Baptism of Desire: Avoiding the Red Herrings on a Nearby Thread
(01-23-2012, 08:56 AM)JoniCath Wrote:
(01-22-2012, 01:31 PM)Stubborn Wrote: In case of emergency Baptism by water can be replaced by Baptism of desire or Baptism by blood. (Sent. fidei prox.) - - - - - - - - FYI, "Fidei Prox" means, "almost a dogma" - or "approximately a dogma". We *are not* bound to believe fidei prox.

I know well what Sent fidei prox means AND what it doesn't mean.  (scroll down to # 57).

The whole "in case of emergency" imaginary scenario neglects or  perverts the the doctrine of Divine Providence entirely.

ONLY if you are confining your thoughts to a certain time, again. One of the Sacred Heart nuns who taught in the Academy I attended, lent a copy of her thesis to me.
It was a history of Catholicism in our city. It told of a time when we were lucky to have a priest up here from St. Louis TWICE A YEAR. Most people who had healthy babies just waited for the priest to Baptize them. A FEW Baptized their own babies. As for Baptizing the Indians we were converting then..well they, themselves seemed to need the ceremony, so they waited for the priest. Some of the babies & the Indians died before the priest came. However, their DESIRE to be Baptized saved them. BOD confers Sanctifying Grace.

I'm not confining anything.

Our Lord did not make the Sacrament obligatory for salvation till sometime just prior to His Ascension into Heaven. Some say He instituted the Sacrament at Pentecost, whatever - one thing for certain is that Baptism was not obligatory before His many people even today it is still not obligatory thanks to BOD.

As such, "Paradise" did not mean heaven, it meant purgatory or the Limbo of the Just - referred to as "hell" in the Apostles Creed.

You feel free to judge and reward salvation to unbaptized Indians etc. all you want - seems silly since you don't even know if you're going to make it - no?

From your link.........A Summary of the Dogmas and Teachings of the Catholic Church - - -  Taken from Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma by Ludwig Ott, available from TAN Books.

The link is good - thanks!

255) The members of the Church are those who have validly received the Sacrament of Baptism and who are not separated from the unity of the confession of the Faith, and from the unity of the lawful communion of the Church. (Sent. certa.)

295) Baptism is a true Sacrament instituted by Jesus Christ. (De fide.)

296) The materia remota of the Sacrament of Baptism is true and natural water. (De fide.)

297) The materia proxima of the Sacrament of Baptism is the ablution, by physical contact, of the body with water. (Sent. certa.)

298) The form of Baptism consists in the words of the minister which accompany it and more closely determine it.

299) Baptism confers the grace of justification. (De fide.)

300) Baptism effects the remission of all punishments of sin, both the eternal and the temporal. (De fide.)

301) Even if it be unworthily received, valid Baptism imprints on the soul of the recipient an indelible spiritual mark, the Baptismal Character, and for this reason, the Sacrament cannot be repeated. (De fide.)

302) Baptism by water (Baptismus fluminis) is, since the promulgation of the Gospel, necessary for all men without exception, for salvation. (De fide.)

303) In case of emergency Baptism by water can be replaced by Baptism of desire or Baptism by blood. (Sent. fidei. prox)

304) Baptism can be validly administered by anyone. (De fide.)

305) Baptism can be received by any person in the wayfaring state who is not already baptised. (De fide.)


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Re: Baptism of Desire: Avoiding the Red Herrings on a Nearby Thread - by Stubborn - 01-23-2012, 09:22 AM

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