Baptism of Desire: Avoiding the Red Herrings on a Nearby Thread
(02-01-2012, 10:51 PM)columb Wrote:
(02-01-2012, 08:41 PM)Parmandur Wrote:
(02-01-2012, 08:29 PM)Gregory I Wrote: The analogy is faulty, because Our Lord said, I say to "YOU" not, I say to all men. The YOU is the crowd following him, who already expressed faith in him, AND his disciples.

The analogy breaks down after that.

Now, explain to me, how do we understand John 3:5 in regards to BOD? Our Lord was not ignorant, what did he MEAN with these words if some are saved apart from water baptism? How are we to take them?

From Aquinas:



Objection 1. It seems that the three kinds of Baptism are not fittingly described as Baptism of Water, of Blood, and of the Spirit, i.e. of the Holy Ghost. Because the Apostle says (Ephesians 4:5): "One Faith, one Baptism." Now there is but one Faith. Therefore there should not be three Baptisms.

Reply to Objection 1. The other two Baptisms are included in the Baptism of Water, which derives its efficacy, both from Christ's Passion and from the Holy Ghost. Consequently for this reason the unity of Baptism is not destroyed.

Your problem isn't really that problematic.

Those of us who argue agasinst BoD are actually in agreement with St. Thomas. He is maintaining that there is but ONE Baptism and  it's of water which contains also the blood and the spirit, therefore the sacrament of Baptism consists of water, blood and spirt and so the three remain undivided and unseperated.
BoD seperates what St. Thomas states remains undivided.

If that's what you think, clearly you don't know what the term Baptism of Desire means.
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Re: Baptism of Desire: Avoiding the Red Herrings on a Nearby Thread - by Parmandur - 02-02-2012, 03:27 AM



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