This Place is a Cesspit
#31
(01-19-2012, 05:18 PM)Mithrandylan Wrote:
(01-19-2012, 12:16 PM)Vox Clamantis Wrote: I just banned two people and am looking to ban a few more. I know how it will turn out, though: they'll mail me and call me a liberal or feminazi or "Jew-lover" or whatever, will most likely run off to another forum and go on about how FE is liberal and not even close to "traditional," etc.

Yeah, this place is part cesspit. You don't know how sorry I am about it, too. But I'm "letting some people go" around here. I'm sick of it. Don't let the few, the loud-mouthed people who like to name-call and who seem to not have much charity taint your view of what "traditional Catholicism" is (those few tend to post more than others, most likely because they're typically young unmarried males with nothing better to do, like raise families and work for a living).

Traditional Catholicism is the truth, set up by Christ Himself. Too bad some of those who claim to be "trad" focus more on venting rather than bringing souls to Christ. Don't let anyone or anything keep you from Christ and His Church, especially not some stupid internet forum. The only thing that will change the public "face" of traditional Catholicism is for those trads who have love in them to post more and to not be run out by the bitter types.

Actually, Vox, if you're banning "fascist sympathizers" they'll likely admire your dictatorship qualities. 
Sieg Heil.
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#32
Ever been to a take away restaurant that you frequent, even though you've had bad food two or three times, you keep on returning because usually their food is excellent and really tasty? You don't avoid that place because you've had one bad bowl of soup, now do you.

You might have experienced a few people who are a bit inclined to being rude and maybe even ignorant, but those are only people, most of which I see only register for an account to post 5 or 6 things, then leave. You shouldn't be turnt away from traditional Catholicism, because of people. People don't matter when it comes to Catholicism, the main thing is is that you are living and believeing as Our God wants you to live and believe: in accordance with the teachings of His Holy Church, for there is only one.

Sure, there are a few people with odd opinions, but not many. If you don't like them, ignore them. Don't post if you don't want to.

Just my thirty worth.
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#33
When I see threads like this, it gives me the visual of a person going into crowded elevator, farting, and then loudly saying "It stinks in here!".

Any person who says anything about the forum as a whole must take into account that it is defined by the totality of the members.

In a dynamic discussion forum, perception of it is based on oneself more than mathematical reality of what is expressed. For example, my perception of the forum is that is a place where mediocrity in intellect and morality is overly praised and anything else is resisted. I know another who thinks this forum expresses liberalism or modernism in some fashion. Others think it is fascist or radical. Others think it is a place where many Catholics can be found for discussion on matters of the faith. Why? Because the metric is invariably based on the individual's perception and social expectations.

If one has negative perceptions, then one should counter them by being what is better.
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#34
I do think there is some connection between some strands of traditionalism and fascism, particularly as seen in places like France. However, mainstream American traditionalism (if such a thing can be mainstream!) seems to have more of a paleoconservative if not libertarian bent to it. 

The reason that many traditionalists tend to be fascistic or even bordering on anti-Semitic is the origin of the SSPX, which for years was the leading proponent of the TLM. Marcel Lefebvre and other foundational figures of the SSPX were highly influenced by French reactionary conservativism. In TLM groups unconnected with the SSPX, such as the institute of Christ the King, are much less likely to have members and followers with such ideologies. The Institute of Christ the King is and always has been more liturgical in focus. When the Institute has ventured into political territory, it has generally been more about ending abortion than restoring monarchy.
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#35
(01-20-2012, 12:37 AM)Resurrexi Wrote: I do think there is some connection between some strands of traditionalism and fascism, particularly as seen in places like France. However, mainstream American traditionalism (if such a thing can be mainstream!) seems to have more of a paleoconservative if not libertarian bent to it. 

The reason that many traditionalists tend to be fascistic or even bordering on anti-Semitic is the origin of the SSPX, which for years was the leading proponent of the TLM. Marcel Lefebvre and other foundational figures of the SSPX were highly influenced by French reactionary conservativism. In TLM groups unconnected with the SSPX, such as the institute of Christ the King, are much less likely to have members and followers with such ideologies. The Institute of Christ the King is and always has been more liturgical in focus. When the Institute has ventured into political territory, it has generally been more about ending abortion than restoring monarchy.
Was Archbishop Lefebvre really involved or interested in civil politics that much?
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#36
(01-20-2012, 12:55 AM)Old Salt Wrote:
(01-20-2012, 12:37 AM)Resurrexi Wrote: I do think there is some connection between some strands of traditionalism and fascism, particularly as seen in places like France. However, mainstream American traditionalism (if such a thing can be mainstream!) seems to have more of a paleoconservative if not libertarian bent to it. 

The reason that many traditionalists tend to be fascistic or even bordering on anti-Semitic is the origin of the SSPX, which for years was the leading proponent of the TLM. Marcel Lefebvre and other foundational figures of the SSPX were highly influenced by French reactionary conservativism. In TLM groups unconnected with the SSPX, such as the institute of Christ the King, are much less likely to have members and followers with such ideologies. The Institute of Christ the King is and always has been more liturgical in focus. When the Institute has ventured into political territory, it has generally been more about ending abortion than restoring monarchy.
Was Archbishop Lefebvre really involved or interested in civil politics that much?

He certainly identified with and was formed by the radical right-wing French politics that were a reaction to the 1789 Revolution.

In contrast, most Americans, trad or otherwise, were formed by and identify with the political ideologies based on the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. British trads, too, have their own tradition of classical liberalism.
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#37
(01-20-2012, 12:55 AM)Old Salt Wrote: Was Archbishop Lefebvre really involved or interested in civil politics that much?

It is my understanding that he was a member/sympathiser of Action Francaise, a reactionary, royalist organisation. Of course, so were most conservative French clergy and many of the laity, (including Jacques Maritain, who later became a flaming social democratic liberal) at the time. The AF was condemned by Rome because its founder and major ideologue, Charles Maurras, was an agnostic (reconciled to the faith before his death), who was simply using the Church as a political tool. The ban was later lifted.

My only problem is that the AF (and its successor organisations) support the freemasonic, revolutionary, usurping Orleans pretender.
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#38
(01-20-2012, 01:01 AM)Resurrexi Wrote: In contrast, most Americans, trad or otherwise, were formed by and identify with the political ideologies based on the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. British trads, too, have their own tradition of classical liberalism.

American born, proud Canadian of British background, and I identify with the Counter-Revolutionary Right in France. To hell (literally) with the Declaration of Independence and its evil spawn, the Declaration of the Rights of Man and the Citizen, and the 'classical liberalism' (=evil, anti-Catholic ideology) of Britain.
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#39
(01-20-2012, 01:09 AM)jovan66102 Wrote:
(01-20-2012, 01:01 AM)Resurrexi Wrote: In contrast, most Americans, trad or otherwise, were formed by and identify with the political ideologies based on the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. British trads, too, have their own tradition of classical liberalism.

American born, proud Canadian of British background, and I identify with the Counter-Revolutionary Right in France. To hell (literally) with the Declaration of Independence and its evil spawn, the Declaration of the Rights of Man and the Citizen, and the 'classical liberalism' (=evil, anti-Catholic ideology) of Britain.

Pope Leo XIII said the American Revolution was divine providence.  You saying Pope Leo XIII supported evil?
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#40
(01-20-2012, 01:09 AM)jovan66102 Wrote:
(01-20-2012, 01:01 AM)Resurrexi Wrote: In contrast, most Americans, trad or otherwise, were formed by and identify with the political ideologies based on the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. British trads, too, have their own tradition of classical liberalism.

American born, proud Canadian of British background, and I identify with the Counter-Revolutionary Right in France. To hell (literally) with the Declaration of Independence and its evil spawn, the Declaration of the Rights of Man and the Citizen, and the 'classical liberalism' (=evil, anti-Catholic ideology) of Britain.

I said "most Americans." You're certainly an anomaly.

Also, I think you're wrong to associate as you do the American Revolution with the French Revolution. The former was conservative and not hostile to religion, whereas the latter was radical and anti-religious.
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