Poll: What will you do?
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The SSPX/Rome Official Poll
#41
(05-14-2012, 01:51 PM)Parmandur Wrote: That was not what the excommunication was about, obviously.

Do you think the excommunications were, in fact, incurred? I think they were persecuted soley for their adherence to the Traditional Mass.
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#42
Whats more I would have thought if they were worried about the letter of the law over the Faith, they would be dancin' along to the tamborines at a NO "liturgy of word and Eucharist" or some such.
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#43
(05-14-2012, 01:55 PM)dueSicile Wrote:
(05-14-2012, 01:51 PM)Parmandur Wrote: That was not what the excommunication was about, obviously.

Do you think the excommunications were, in fact, incurred? I think they were persecuted soley for their adherence to the Traditional Mass.

Well, the Vatican has taken away the penalties of excommunication, but the Pope was also fairly clearly not annulling them, so that the excommunications happened remain as a fact of canon law.  The excommunications happened because ++Lefebvre committed an objective act of schism, may God have mercy on his soul.  He was ordered not to consecrate bishops, and given canon law he had no right to do so, and every duty to listen to the Pope.  To say it is because of adherence to the Mass is ahistorical.
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#44
And it should be noted that ++Lefebvre remains excommunicated to this day.  We may pray and hope that this will get sorted out in time, but the case of Savonarola does not inspire much hope for the late Archbishop.
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#45
(05-14-2012, 01:58 PM)Parmandur Wrote:
(05-14-2012, 01:55 PM)dueSicile Wrote:
(05-14-2012, 01:51 PM)Parmandur Wrote: That was not what the excommunication was about, obviously.

Do you think the excommunications were, in fact, incurred? I think they were persecuted soley for their adherence to the Traditional Mass.

Well, the Vatican has taken away the penalties of excommunication, but the Pope was also fairly clearly not annulling them, so that the excommunications happened remain as a fact of canon law.  The excommunications happened because ++Lefebvre committed an objective act of schism, may God have mercy on his soul.  He was ordered not to consecrate bishops, and given canon law he had no right to do so, and every duty to listen to the Pope.  To say it is because of adherence to the Mass is ahistorical.

I'll have to disagree with you there.
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#46
(05-14-2012, 02:01 PM)Parmandur Wrote: And it should be noted that ++Lefebvre remains excommunicated to this day.  We may pray and hope that this will get sorted out in time, but the case of Savonarola does not inspire much hope for the late Archbishop.

Like Lefebvre, Savonarola was another martyr of papal intolerance.
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#47
I went with: "If the SSPX is regularized, I will continue to attend their masses,  regardless of any compromise, percieved or otherwise."

I've only been to the closest SSPX chapel once (St. Michael's in Roswell, Georgia) - I don't perceive their canonical status to be a reason to avoid their Masses (although I did not go to Confession there because my mind isn't made up on that issue).  

The FSSP is closer for me so I go there.  Even then, the FSSP is 90 miles one-way and the SSPX is 100 miles one-way... So, it's a long Sunday going to either one for Mass.
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#48
(05-14-2012, 01:55 PM)dueSicile Wrote:
(05-14-2012, 01:51 PM)Parmandur Wrote: That was not what the excommunication was about, obviously.

Do you think the excommunications were, in fact, incurred? I think they were persecuted soley for their adherence to the Traditional Mass.

Well, it's not just the Mass which is important, but the Catholic faith in its entirety. Fr. Alfred Loisy said the traditional Mass, yet he was a notorious modernist and excommunicated vitandus by St. Pius X.

+Lefebvre sought to preserve the traditional priesthood and the entire Faith, not just the liturgy.
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#49
(05-14-2012, 02:02 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote:
(05-14-2012, 02:01 PM)Parmandur Wrote: And it should be noted that ++Lefebvre remains excommunicated to this day.  We may pray and hope that this will get sorted out in time, but the case of Savonarola does not inspire much hope for the late Archbishop.

Like Lefebvre, Savonarola was another martyr of papal intolerance.

Indeed, St. Phillip Neri slept with an icon of Savonarola by his bedside, and told the Oratorians that the Holy Ghost had revealed to him that Savonarola is among the blessed.  Many miracles have been attributed to Savonarola, which have been strenuously ignored by the Vatican.  So as I said, I wouldn't lay any bets on ++Lefebvre anytime soon.
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#50
(05-14-2012, 02:01 PM)Parmandur Wrote: And it should be noted that ++Lefebvre remains excommunicated to this day.  We may pray and hope that this will get sorted out in time, but the case of Savonarola does not inspire much hope for the late Archbishop.

http://www.sspx.org/SSPX_FAQs/q11_archbi...icated.htm

I'm not trying to get into an argument, but here is why I think he wasn't.
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