Purportedly an SSPX priest against the Deal
#11
Fr. Pfeiffer has delivered some of the best sermons I have ever heard. God bless him.
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#12
(05-29-2012, 12:23 PM)Crusader_Philly Wrote: Fr. Pfeiffer has delivered some of the best sermons I have ever heard. God bless him.


Are the SSPX in the Church though ? There appears to be some ambiguity on the matter:


http://ronconte.wordpress.com/2012/04/21...gisterium/

http://ronconte.wordpress.com/2012/04/19...rue-faith/

The titles of these links speak for themselves - they are interesting, at least.

From the second:


"No signed document and no set of negotiations can return the leaders and members of the SSPX to the one true Church, until and unless:

1. they admit that they have sinned gravely,
2. they repent from those sins,
3. they receive the Sacrament of Reconciliation, from a priest or bishop who can lift an excommunication,
4. they accept the teaching authority and the temporal authority of the Second Vatican Council,
5. they specifically accept the particular teachings of the Second Vatican Council,
6. they accept the teaching authority and the temporal authority of the Popes and the body of Bishops in communion with him since the Second Vatican Council,
7. they specifically accept the particular teachings of the Popes and the body of Bishops in communion with him since the Second Vatican Council,
8. they unite themselves in love, faith, and hope to the Pope and his successors, and to the body of Bishops and their successors;
9. they repent from and cease all arrogance, malice, and claims of grave errors in magisterial teachings."

## I wonder where Rome stands on this ?  If the SSPX are not Catholics, how many bishops  - & Catholics -  are ?

Unless all ambiguity as to Rome's attitude to the SSPX is cleared up, a deal would be crazy. Rome cannot be allowed to get away with speaking out of both of its mouths. If it is not honest and truthful, nothing it says can be trusted.

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#13
Fr. Pfeiffer's sermons are here:  http://op54rosary.ning.com/forum/topics/...x-and-rome
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#14
Let's pray that Bishop Fellay does net get forced into con-celebrating the NO mass like the FSSP does, because they capitulated, gave in and accepted error.


These are dark times. May God help us all.


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#15
(05-30-2012, 01:40 AM)John Lane Wrote: Fr. Pfeiffer's sermons are here:  http://op54rosary.ning.com/forum/topics/...x-and-rome

Has anyone here listened to these?
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#16
(05-30-2012, 01:33 AM)Leo Rugiens Wrote:
(05-29-2012, 12:23 PM)Crusader_Philly Wrote: Fr. Pfeiffer has delivered some of the best sermons I have ever heard. God bless him.


Are the SSPX in the Church though ? There appears to be some ambiguity on the matter:


http://ronconte.wordpress.com/2012/04/21...gisterium/

http://ronconte.wordpress.com/2012/04/19...rue-faith/

The titles of these links speak for themselves - they are interesting, at least.

From the second:


"No signed document and no set of negotiations can return the leaders and members of the SSPX to the one true Church, until and unless:

1. they admit that they have sinned gravely,
2. they repent from those sins,
3. they receive the Sacrament of Reconciliation, from a priest or bishop who can lift an excommunication,
4. they accept the teaching authority and the temporal authority of the Second Vatican Council,
5. they specifically accept the particular teachings of the Second Vatican Council,
6. they accept the teaching authority and the temporal authority of the Popes and the body of Bishops in communion with him since the Second Vatican Council,
7. they specifically accept the particular teachings of the Popes and the body of Bishops in communion with him since the Second Vatican Council,
8. they unite themselves in love, faith, and hope to the Pope and his successors, and to the body of Bishops and their successors;
9. they repent from and cease all arrogance, malice, and claims of grave errors in magisterial teachings."

## I wonder where Rome stands on this ?  If the SSPX are not Catholics, how many bishops  - & Catholics -  are ?

Unless all ambiguity as to Rome's attitude to the SSPX is cleared up, a deal would be crazy. Rome cannot be allowed to get away with speaking out of both of its mouths. If it is not honest and truthful, nothing it says can be trusted.

Should I respond to this?
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#17
(05-30-2012, 01:57 AM)GottmitunsAlex Wrote: Let's pray that Bishop Fellay does net get forced into con-celebrating the NO mass like the FSSP does, because they capitulated, gave in and accepted error.


These are dark times. May God help us all.

## Amen to that !
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#18
(05-30-2012, 07:48 PM)Crusader_Philly Wrote:
(05-30-2012, 01:33 AM)Leo Rugiens Wrote:
(05-29-2012, 12:23 PM)Crusader_Philly Wrote: Fr. Pfeiffer has delivered some of the best sermons I have ever heard. God bless him.


Are the SSPX in the Church though ? There appears to be some ambiguity on the matter:


http://ronconte.wordpress.com/2012/04/21...gisterium/

http://ronconte.wordpress.com/2012/04/19...rue-faith/

The titles of these links speak for themselves - they are interesting, at least.

From the second:


"No signed document and no set of negotiations can return the leaders and members of the SSPX to the one true Church, until and unless:

1. they admit that they have sinned gravely,
2. they repent from those sins,
3. they receive the Sacrament of Reconciliation, from a priest or bishop who can lift an excommunication,
4. they accept the teaching authority and the temporal authority of the Second Vatican Council,
5. they specifically accept the particular teachings of the Second Vatican Council,
6. they accept the teaching authority and the temporal authority of the Popes and the body of Bishops in communion with him since the Second Vatican Council,
7. they specifically accept the particular teachings of the Popes and the body of Bishops in communion with him since the Second Vatican Council,
8. they unite themselves in love, faith, and hope to the Pope and his successors, and to the body of Bishops and their successors;
9. they repent from and cease all arrogance, malice, and claims of grave errors in magisterial teachings."

## I wonder where Rome stands on this ?  If the SSPX are not Catholics, how many bishops  - & Catholics -  are ?

Unless all ambiguity as to Rome's attitude to the SSPX is cleared up, a deal would be crazy. Rome cannot be allowed to get away with speaking out of both of its mouths. If it is not honest and truthful, nothing it says can be trusted.

Should I respond to this?

## It would help :) FWIW, I think he is wrong. Equally, suppose he is right, and that the lifting of excommunications is either incomplete (as the author contends), or is a feint  (which is what bothers me). At any rate, ISTM that his position needs to be answered,if only  to help others who may be as surprised/puzzled/bothered. If he is right, the Church is not being at all straightforward, but very devious :( 
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#19
(05-28-2012, 11:29 PM)B of Navarre Wrote:
(05-28-2012, 12:28 PM)John Lane Wrote:
(05-28-2012, 08:01 AM)PeterII Wrote: No he's off target because he is just talking in generalities.  What specifically did the SSPX disobey the Pope on?  The only thing really was the consecration of the Bishops, which Archbishop Lefebvre had the canonical and divine right to do. 

The priest above says that Rome is the seat of Antichrist because of private revelation, and the hierarchy are heretical.  Well, if that's how you feel....  And what's with the creepy sexual innuendo?  Fornicating, Adultery, Temptation... :O

What you think is creepy is all through sacred scripture, in which spiritual unfaithfulness is constantly referred to as "fornication."
Yes.
Archbishop Lefebvre Wrote:The union desired by these Liberal Catholics, a union between the Church and the Revolution and subversion is, for the Church, an adulterous union, adulterous. And that adulterous union can produce only bastards.  And who are those bastards? They are our rites: the rite of Mass is a bastard rite, the sacraments are bastard sacraments-we no longer know if they are sacraments which give grace or which do not give grace … The priests coming out of the seminaries are bastard priests.”

The bastard metaphor is a powerful device, but Archbishop Lefebvre used such things sparingly. This priest on the other hand is eccentric, and his strange style throughout the letter leads to suspicion of an unhinged mind.  WAR ON WAR ON WAR ON WAR ON WAR ON  :eyeroll:

And how can a Catholic justify lines like this, "In the light of the above, we can now determine that to place ourselves under Benedict XVI is an adultery from the truth."  Really now?  Being subject to the Roman Pontiff is an adultery from the truth?  Enjoy your new religion. 
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#20
"Enjoy your new religion."

I do believe it is Benedict with the new religion. You probably heard of it, the religion of man or Norvus Ordo. Here below he talks a little about his new religion.


Vatican City, Feb 1, 2007 / 10:14 am (CNA).- Today in the Vatican, Benedict XVI received a delegation from the Foundation for Inter-religious and Inter-cultural Research and Dialogue, led by their president, Metropolitan Archbishop Damskinos of Adrianoupoli. Among the members of the delegation was also His Royal Highness Prince Hassan of Jordan.

In his address to the group the Pope, who as Cardinal Ratzinger was one of the foundation's founding members, thanked Metropolitan Damaskinos for his gift of the first fruit of their labors: a joint edition of the three sacred texts of the three monotheistic religions, in chronological order and in the original languages. "It was our first project," the Pope recalled, "to make a specific and positive contribution to dialogue between cultures and religions."

"Jews, Christians, and Muslims," he went on, "are called to recognize and strengthen the ties that bind us together. It was this idea that brought us to create the foundation, the objective of which is to discover 'the most essential and most authentic message that the three monotheistic religions - Judaism, Christianity and Islam - can communicate to the 21st century world,' with the aim of giving a fresh impulse to inter-religious and inter-cultural dialogue through the joint discovery and communication of the elements in our respective spiritual legacies that contribute to reinforcing the fraternal bonds between our communities of believers."

"The rereading - for some people the discovery - of texts that are sacred to so many people enforces our mutual respect," said the Holy Father. "Men and women today await from us a message of harmony and tranquility, and the concrete expression of our shared will to help them realize their legitimate aspirations to live in justice and peace."

"The work of the foundation will contribute to raising ever greater awareness of all the aspects of the various cultures of our time that correspond to divine wisdom and serve the dignity of man. This will lead to greater discernment, and to a rejection of all usurpation of the name of God and denaturalization of man's humanity."

"Our respective religious traditions," Pope Benedict concluded, "underline the sacred nature of life and the dignity of the human person. ... We, with all men and women of good will, long for peace. For this reason I reiterate that inter-religious and inter-cultural dialogue and research are not an option, but a vital necessity of our time."

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/j...pope_says/

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