Sunday obligation on a Saturday at SSPX?
#11
(07-21-2012, 08:48 AM)PeterII Wrote:
Aragon Wrote:The 1917 code is no longer in force. If you can make it to the Mass on Saturday evening then you're obligated to go.

No one is obligated by ecclesiastical law in the modern crisis.  There are plenty of justifications not to fulfill the Sunday obligation, particularly when your option is a Novus Ordo mass. 

On the contrary...the most important time to follow law is in times of chaos.

Joining in the crisis by further dissenting is not the answer and is in fact the problem.

Nobody thinks the rules apply to them...
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#12
It turns out that I am unable to attend Mass tomorrow due to the timing of my flight.  This discussion makes it clear to me that I am obliged to attend a NO Mass this evening since there are no TLMs available other than on Sunday.
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#13
(07-21-2012, 08:48 AM)PeterII Wrote:
Aragon Wrote:The 1917 code is no longer in force. If you can make it to the Mass on Saturday evening then you're obligated to go.

No one is obligated by ecclesiastical law in the modern crisis.  There are plenty of justifications not to fulfill the Sunday obligation, particularly when your option is a Novus Ordo mass. 

We're talking about a TLM.
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#14
(07-21-2012, 09:12 AM)Aragon Wrote:
(07-21-2012, 08:48 AM)PeterII Wrote:
Aragon Wrote:The 1917 code is no longer in force. If you can make it to the Mass on Saturday evening then you're obligated to go.

No one is obligated by ecclesiastical law in the modern crisis.  There are plenty of justifications not to fulfill the Sunday obligation, particularly when your option is a Novus Ordo mass. 

We're talking about a TLM.

Even then.  Whether it be a clown mass that Rosarium would attend to fulfill the letter of the law, or a diocesan approved TLM, a Traditionalist has no moral obligation to cooperate with conciliarist authorities, which can be subjectively determined.  That dispenses one from ecclesiastical law. 
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#15
Speaking of Sunday obligation on a Saturday.................

From Fr. Wathen's "Who Shall Ascend?" (Emphasis in original)

Pope Paul VI..........---destroyed the holiness and the obligation of Sunday by allowing the Saturday evening Mass.  To this grave sacrilege, the whole Catholic world seems strangely, or should we say, characteristically, unresponsive.  The Sunday obligation is most certainly of the Apostolic tradition.  The reformers argue that all may touch the Sacred Host because the early Christians did.  They make no such argument regarding our Sunday obligation for the obvious reason that, from the very first, the Christian sabbath was Sunday, and began at midnight.  (Acts 20:7).  For this Revolutionary act, the Pope must needs return to the Old Testament!  This act alone has resulted in who knows how many millions never having returned to Church on Sunday from that day to this, thus piling mortal sins on mortal sins, because, make no mistake about it, the pope is not the "Lord of the Sabbath," (Mt. 12 vs 8 ).  for only Christ is.  Moreover, by this act, Pope Paul caused that the Third Commandment be completely discarded by other millions.  Thus, the Pope of Rome did what the anti-Christian Establishment had never succeeded in doing, with all their Sunday sales and sports spectaculars and entertainment extravaganzas, and that by a simple motu proprio, whose date few remember.

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#16
(07-21-2012, 09:29 AM)PeterII Wrote:
(07-21-2012, 09:12 AM)Aragon Wrote:
(07-21-2012, 08:48 AM)PeterII Wrote:
Aragon Wrote:The 1917 code is no longer in force. If you can make it to the Mass on Saturday evening then you're obligated to go.

No one is obligated by ecclesiastical law in the modern crisis.  There are plenty of justifications not to fulfill the Sunday obligation, particularly when your option is a Novus Ordo mass. 

We're talking about a TLM.

Even then.  Whether it be a clown mass that Rosarium would attend to fulfill the letter of the law, or a diocesan approved TLM, a Traditionalist has no moral obligation to cooperate with conciliarist authorities, which can be subjectively determined.  That dispenses one from ecclesiastical law. 

By "Concilliarist authorities" you mean the Holy Father and bishops with jurisdiction over you, right? We can only disregard a law when it is dangerous to our Faith, unless you can show that a TLM offered by a priest with faculties is endangering your soul then you are duty bound to attend it to fulfil your Sunday obligation.
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#17
(07-21-2012, 11:33 AM)Aragon Wrote:
(07-21-2012, 09:29 AM)PeterII Wrote:
(07-21-2012, 09:12 AM)Aragon Wrote:
(07-21-2012, 08:48 AM)PeterII Wrote:
Aragon Wrote:The 1917 code is no longer in force. If you can make it to the Mass on Saturday evening then you're obligated to go.

No one is obligated by ecclesiastical law in the modern crisis.  There are plenty of justifications not to fulfill the Sunday obligation, particularly when your option is a Novus Ordo mass. 

We're talking about a TLM.

Even then.  Whether it be a clown mass that Rosarium would attend to fulfill the letter of the law, or a diocesan approved TLM, a Traditionalist has no moral obligation to cooperate with conciliarist authorities, which can be subjectively determined.  That dispenses one from ecclesiastical law. 

By "Concilliarist authorities" you mean the Holy Father and bishops with jurisdiction over you, right? We can only disregard a law when it is dangerous to our Faith, unless you can show that a TLM offered by a priest with faculties is endangering your soul then you are duty bound to attend it to fulfil your Sunday obligation.

A priest with faculties offering a TLM has unnecessarily subjected himself to bishops who endanger souls with conciliarist nonsense.  That can be a dangerous influence on one's faith and therefore sufficent reason not to go to mass with them. 
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#18
Drink your own poison, PeterII.

People read this forum and your errors are grave. You cannot destroy the Church and rebuild it as you see fit. It exists independently of you, and you are attempting to lead others away from the Church.

Catechism of Pius X Wrote:8 Q. What is the Catholic Church?
A. The Catholic Church is the Union or Congregation of all the baptised who, still living on earth, profess the same Faith and the same Law of Jesus Christ, participate in the same Sacraments, and obey their lawful Pastors, particularly the Roman Pontiff.
9 Q. State distinctly what is necessary to be a member of the Church?
A. To be a member of the Church it is necessary to be baptised, to believe and profess the teaching of Jesus Christ, to participate in the same Sacraments, and to acknowledge the Pope and the other lawful pastors of the Church.

10 Q. Who are the lawful pastors of the Church?
A. The lawful pastors of the Church are the Roman Pontiff, that is, the Pope, who is Supreme Pastor, and the Bishops. Other priests, also, and especially Parish Priests, have a share in the pastoral office, subject to the Bishop and the Pope.

11 Q. Why do you say that the Roman Pontiff is supreme Pastor of the Church?
A. Because Jesus Christ said to St. Peter, the first Pope: "Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build My Church, and I will give to thee the keys of the Kingdom of Heaven, and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound also in Heaven, and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed also in Heaven." And again: "Feed My lambs, feed My sheep."

12 Q. The many societies of persons who are baptised but who do not acknowledge the Roman Pontiff as their Head do not, then, belong to the Church of Jesus Christ?
A. No, those who do not acknowledge the Roman Pontiff as their Head do not belong to the Church of Jesus Christ.
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#19
(07-21-2012, 03:17 PM)Rosarium Wrote: Drink your own poison, PeterII.

People read this forum and your errors are grave. You cannot destroy the Church and rebuild it as you see fit. It exists independently of you, and you are attempting to lead others away from the Church.

You're just a legal positivist trying to confuse Traditionalists.  Go play on a Novus Ordo forum. 
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#20
(07-21-2012, 12:51 PM)PeterII Wrote:
(07-21-2012, 11:33 AM)Aragon Wrote:
(07-21-2012, 09:29 AM)PeterII Wrote:
(07-21-2012, 09:12 AM)Aragon Wrote:
(07-21-2012, 08:48 AM)PeterII Wrote:
Aragon Wrote:The 1917 code is no longer in force. If you can make it to the Mass on Saturday evening then you're obligated to go.

No one is obligated by ecclesiastical law in the modern crisis.  There are plenty of justifications not to fulfill the Sunday obligation, particularly when your option is a Novus Ordo mass. 

We're talking about a TLM.

Even then.  Whether it be a clown mass that Rosarium would attend to fulfill the letter of the law, or a diocesan approved TLM, a Traditionalist has no moral obligation to cooperate with conciliarist authorities, which can be subjectively determined.  That dispenses one from ecclesiastical law. 

By "Concilliarist authorities" you mean the Holy Father and bishops with jurisdiction over you, right? We can only disregard a law when it is dangerous to our Faith, unless you can show that a TLM offered by a priest with faculties is endangering your soul then you are duty bound to attend it to fulfil your Sunday obligation.

A priest with faculties offering a TLM has unnecessarily subjected himself to bishops who endanger souls with conciliarist nonsense.  That can be a dangerous influence on one's faith and therefore sufficent reason not to go to mass with them. 

Nonsense. Go to an approved Mass centre and see if it's a dangerous influence on your Faith.
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