Please vote on Fr. Z poll

[Romish Papist]

I voted yes...but in retrospect it's probably not the correct vote. Yes, Vatican 2 has been very bad and the cause of many of the problems. But the spirit of modernism was in the Church long before V2 happened. Let's face it, the modernists that gave us V2 were in positions of power during the "good ol' days."

Weren't a number of them under suspicion by the Holy Office, and weren't some of them also forbidden to teach (with a few of them having their books placed on the Index)?  I don't think all or even most them were in positions of power under Pope Pius XII (Pope John XXIII is another story, however...).  Please correct me if I'm wrong.

If I recall, Pius XI and XII wanted to call the Second Vatican Council but were discouraged to by whoever advises popes because there were fears that modernists would hijack the council.

I'd like to see that for myself.  Do you remember where you read it?  What their intentions were?

[Mithrandylan]

I voted yes...but in retrospect it's probably not the correct vote. Yes, Vatican 2 has been very bad and the cause of many of the problems. But the spirit of modernism was in the Church long before V2 happened. Let's face it, the modernists that gave us V2 were in positions of power during the "good ol' days."

Weren't a number of them under suspicion by the Holy Office, and weren't some of them also forbidden to teach (with a few of them having their books placed on the Index)?  I don't think all or even most them were in positions of power under Pope Pius XII (Pope John XXIII is another story, however...).  Please correct me if I'm wrong.

If I recall, Pius XI and XII wanted to call the Second Vatican Council but were discouraged to by whoever advises popes because there were fears that modernists would hijack the council.

I'd like to see that for myself.  Do you remember where you read it?  What their intentions were?

I'm looking for the primary source, I have secondary ones.

[SaintRafael]

As of 7:16 pm est, the yes vote has made it to 49%. It stands at 51% no with 854 Votes, to 49% yes with 818 Votes.

[per_passionem_eius]

Might4right,

... for some reason every time you speak here I'm overcome with a feeling of almost nauseating sadness... What could it be?  Hmm...  Ah yes!  It's your profile picture!!

Me too! 

Tell the story, M4R!  Cheer us up!  Tell us the happy ending, won't you?!

[Clare Brigid]

7:44 EST.  Only 30 votes difference!

[Petertherock]

Actually...the question is was V2 "mostly" to blame...so the correct answer would be yes which is of course what I voted. So I was mistaken. It would only be wrong if it said V2 is only to blame.

[Might_4_Right]

Wow, we are at 49%!  Let’s keep it going.

"Yes, Vatican II is mostly to blame for problems in the Church today. (49%, 803 Votes)"

Might4right,

I like some of what you say on these forums, but for some reason every time you speak here I'm overcome with a feeling of almost nauseating sadness... What could it be?  Hmm...  Ah yes!  It's your profile picture!!

That's funny Romish Papist. I haven't given my profile pic much thought at least not since I first choose it. I've had the same profile picture since I first came to fisheaters. And I've never changed it because I like consistency. And because being such a visual person I would build such a strong association between other peoples profile pics and them that I found it very disorienting when others would change theirs. And sadly, but I hope not nauseatingly so, in a real sense my profile picture does represent me.

[Romish Papist]

Wow, we are at 49%!  Let’s keep it going.

"Yes, Vatican II is mostly to blame for problems in the Church today. (49%, 803 Votes)"

Might4right,

I like some of what you say on these forums, but for some reason every time you speak here I'm overcome with a feeling of almost nauseating sadness... What could it be?  Hmm...  Ah yes!  It's your profile picture!!

That's funny Romish Papist. I haven't given my profile pic much thought at least not since I first choose it. I've had the same profile picture since I first came to fisheaters. And I've never changed it because I like consistency. And because being such a visual person I would build such a strong association between other peoples profile pics and them that I found it very disorienting when others would change theirs. And sadly, but I hope not nauseatingly so, in a real sense my profile picture does represent me.

No worries: I'll just hold my thumb over it from now on when I read your posts.  Hang on a sec while I open another tab and try it out....
...yup!  it works!

[Might_4_Right]

Wow, we are at 49%!  Let’s keep it going.

"Yes, Vatican II is mostly to blame for problems in the Church today. (49%, 803 Votes)"

Might4right,

I like some of what you say on these forums, but for some reason every time you speak here I'm overcome with a feeling of almost nauseating sadness... What could it be?  Hmm...  Ah yes!  It's your profile picture!!

That's funny Romish Papist. I haven't given my profile pic much thought at least not since I first choose it. I've had the same profile picture since I first came to fisheaters. And I've never changed it because I like consistency. And because being such a visual person I would build such a strong association between other peoples profile pics and them that I found it very disorienting when others would change theirs. And sadly, but I hope not nauseatingly so, in a real sense my profile picture does represent me.

No worries: I'll just hold my thumb over it from now on when I read your posts.  Hang on a sec while I open another tab and try it out....
...yup!  it works!

[Might_4_Right]

It's really close now. We're just 24 votes behind.

No, Vatican II itself is not to blame for our problems. (50%, 879 Votes)
Yes, Vatican II is mostly to blame for problems in the Church today. (49%, 855 Votes)