So, I've been thinking...
#11
I never felt so much pressure to be making money hand-over-fist until I became a traditional Catholic. Now I feel angry everyday because I'm poor. I have a wealth of talent but apparently that counts for nothing with arch-pragmatist, "what's the dollar value" Trad Dad.

I'm an idealist and I'm pursuing a job that satisfies me even if it won't pay like an engineer, lawyer, or doctor job would. If that's incomprehensible to Trad Dad then damn the old fool, he doesn't get to decide who his of-age daughter should be marrying anyway.
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#12
Wolfie you ever looked into a Michael Jackson kit?

After that, start hitting up the country clubs.
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#13
(10-16-2012, 02:49 PM)LoneWolfRadTrad Wrote: It seems trad parents have a sort of list they expect for their daughters.

***He goes to confession and Mass. Check***

***He has a prayer life. Check***

***He is traditional in his doctrinal beliefs concerning the Church, marriage, raising children, educating them, etc.***

***Our daughter likes him***

At this point I would say I meet the above requirements coming across trad girls and their families.  But...

It seems there's a *secret* list.  An unwritten one that undermines the hierarchy of needs.  One would think the above are of utmost importance.  Apparently not.

I have suspicions.  Is it that I'm poor?  Is it that I'm not a "WASPy looking"/tuck your shirt in/Leave it to Beaver 1950's guy(I dress up for Mass, and my regular clothes are pretty... normal, no sagging pants, no obscene images on shirts)? Is it that I listen to rock music(not screaming Satanic death metal or anything THAT bad)?  Is it that my family is nominally Catholic at best?  Is it that I'm not the picturesque, prep school, corporate type that would look great in a family photo?



LoneWolfRadTrad  In answer to your first question.  I have 3 married adult  children.  Looks ("WASPy looking"/tuck your shirt in/Leave it to Beaver 1950's guy)  have little to do with it.  My daughter-in-law is Black.  Tho not Catholic, she is naturally good and we are praying for her conversion.  My son-in-law (upswife's husband) is of Mexican descent, and my other son-in-law, adeodatus01, dresses very casually to say the least.  I don't care what they look like in the family photo.

To your list above, I would add repects my daughter for the unique individual she is----and is not so crazy that I'd have to worry about my daughter being beaten or killed.  Though a prospective son-in-law does not need to be a professional, I am concerned that he be able to provide and take care of a family.  I'm not talking about living high.  My husband and I had to scrimp and sacrifice in our early marriage and I'm sure my children do too.  But he needs to show that he has some means of taking care of her and any children they have.  A regular job with health insurance is a good start.  If not that, something .(like possible home ownership, savings,education, prospect of a job, skill in a trade, etc)  I think that is a realistic expectation.

I also want to see that a prospective spouse have a certain amount of maturity.  Not only that he understands Catholic marriage, but is capable of the give and take that marriage requires.  And he must absolutely love my daughter and be willing to die (both to himself and in reality) for her.

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#14
(10-16-2012, 05:21 PM)orate Wrote: LoneWolfRadTrad  In answer to your first question.  I have 3 married adult  children.  Looks ("WASPy looking"/tuck your shirt in/Leave it to Beaver 1950's guy)  have little to do with it.  My daughter-in-law is Black.  Tho not Catholic, she is naturally good and we are praying for her conversion.  My son-in-law (upswife's husband) is of Mexican descent, and my other son-in-law, adeodatus01, dresses very casually to say the least.  I don't care what they look like in the family photo.

To your list above, I would add repects my daughter for the unique individual she is----and is not so crazy that I'd have to worry about my daughter being beaten or killed.  Though a prospective son-in-law does not need to be a professional, I am concerned that he be able to provide and take care of a family.  I'm not talking about living high.  My husband and I had to scrimp and sacrifice in our early marriage and I'm sure my children do too.  But he needs to show that he has some means of taking care of her and any children they have.  A regular job with health insurance is a good start.  If not that, something .(like possible home ownership, savings,education, prospect of a job, skill in a trade, etc)  I think that is a realistic expectation.

I also want to see that a prospective spouse have a certain amount of maturity.  Not only that he understands Catholic marriage, but is capable of the give and take that marriage requires.  And he must absolutely love my daughter and be willing to die (both to himself and in reality) for her.

Great post, orate.
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#15
(10-16-2012, 03:08 PM)The_Harlequin_King Wrote: Sorry to hear that. Is talking politics really necessary? I generally avoid political discussions unless I'm with friends or on the Internet. I certainly wouldn't talk about it with prospective in-laws unless they really wanted to know what I think on such-and-such a topic.

What??? No.

I'm saying they're two separate issues trad parents should work on. 
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#16
What I actually meant in my earlier post is that rather than directly pursuing the young woman, it may be more profitable to simply develop friendships with the family.  If you can establish a reputation as a practicing Catholic that's well-mannered, industrious and possesses many useful talents then parents are likely to start viewing you as a good prospect for their daughters.

And yes, financial stability will go a long ways in winning the attention of parents and young ladies.  Riches aren't as important as stability.  James is correct when he states that having significant savings will level the playing field and give you an aura of confidence.  Eliminate every unnecessary expense, pay off debts and put the rest into savings..  A single man living frugally can put away a large amount of cash in very little time even on a low income.

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#17
Conquest, man.  You gotta win the lady, even over her parents.  Later you can expand your kingdom to include them, too.

Don't let 'em get ya down.  If your intentions are right, God will be on your side.  And if God is with us, not even TRAD DAD can be against us!!!

LOL
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#18
I will be detering all of my daughters (I have 3) from having any contact with males. I activly encouarge them all to be nuns.
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#19
(10-16-2012, 09:55 PM)Adam_Michael Wrote: I will be detering all of my daughters (I have 3) from having any contact with males. I activly encouarge them all to be nuns.

St. Augustine and I wish you the most brilliant success.

Your wife, however, may want grandchildren, and there may be plenty of young trad men on her side.  If such be God's will, I wish them good success as well!
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#20
(10-16-2012, 09:21 PM)LoneWolfRadTrad Wrote:
(10-16-2012, 03:08 PM)The_Harlequin_King Wrote: Sorry to hear that. Is talking politics really necessary? I generally avoid political discussions unless I'm with friends or on the Internet. I certainly wouldn't talk about it with prospective in-laws unless they really wanted to know what I think on such-and-such a topic.

What??? No.

I'm saying they're two separate issues trad parents should work on. 

Alright. Still, a prospective in-law's political views should be irrelevant to your situation if it's all just table-talk.


(10-16-2012, 09:48 PM)Akavit Wrote: What I actually meant in my earlier post is that rather than directly pursuing the young woman, it may be more profitable to simply develop friendships with the family.  If you can establish a reputation as a practicing Catholic that's well-mannered, industrious and possesses many useful talents then parents are likely to start viewing you as a good prospect for their daughters.

It's possible. It's also possible that doing so will just make a young man a chump for working to accomplish an impossible task: pleasing parents. It's like Sisyphus trying to roll the boulder to the top of the hill in Tartarus; it's just not gonna happen.

The best way to get a trad family to accept you is actually to elope with the girl. Once you're married, assuming they're really trad, they're not going to tell their daughter to get a divorce.
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