Smoking pot a mortal sin
#11
(10-30-2012, 08:46 PM)per_passionem_eius Wrote: I've noticed that even people who smoke marijuana occasionally go through great difficulty when they try to give it up.  If it's not physically addictive, it is emotionally.  It happens so quickly, and the effect itself makes a person deny their dependence on it.  I've seen literally countless people go quite crazy when the stuff wasn't available for weeks at a time.  People who use it 'recreationally' usually have anger problems.  I've known people to start smoking crack just because there was no marijuana around.  Making it legal wouldn't help a person like this avoid sin, because the problem itself is in the emotional dependence.

Do you suppose the anger problems come from the pot, or is the pot covering up the anger problems?  Is the pot the cause or the crutch in your experience?
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#12
(10-30-2012, 08:42 PM)knittycat Wrote: Tobacco is food oriented? Since when?

Tobacco was made for common consumption. Tobacco can used regularly, it be moderated, and used as part of sobriety. Tobacco is not a drug. Tobacco does not alter your consciousness and impairs reason like the illegitimate use of some drugs.
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#13
(10-30-2012, 08:50 PM)knittycat Wrote:
(10-30-2012, 08:46 PM)per_passionem_eius Wrote: I've noticed that even people who smoke marijuana occasionally go through great difficulty when they try to give it up.  If it's not physically addictive, it is emotionally.  It happens so quickly, and the effect itself makes a person deny their dependence on it.  I've seen literally countless people go quite crazy when the stuff wasn't available for weeks at a time.  People who use it 'recreationally' usually have anger problems.  I've known people to start smoking crack just because there was no marijuana around.  Making it legal wouldn't help a person like this avoid sin, because the problem itself is in the emotional dependence.

Do you suppose the anger problems come from the pot, or is the pot covering up the anger problems?  Is the pot the cause or the crutch in your experience?

I don't know.  But either way, it seems obvious to me that it's avoiding dealing with the anger.  I've noticed it stunts people's emotional and spiritual growth.  I don't know how it couldn't.
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#14
I would think that the moderate use of narcotics for a sufficient or grave reason would be morally licit.  The only reason/condition for it to become would be a prohibition by positive law, which is what we have now.
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#15
(10-30-2012, 08:51 PM)SaintRafael Wrote:
(10-30-2012, 08:42 PM)knittycat Wrote: Tobacco is food oriented? Since when?

Tobacco was made for common consumption. Tobacco can used regularly, it be moderated, and used as part of sobriety. Tobacco is not a drug. Tobacco does not alter your consciousness and impairs reason like the illegitimate use of some drugs.

Tobacco contains nicotine which is a drug, and quite addictive, but unlike marijuana, it never effects a person's judgement.
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#16
(10-30-2012, 08:52 PM)per_passionem_eius Wrote:
(10-30-2012, 08:50 PM)knittycat Wrote:
(10-30-2012, 08:46 PM)per_passionem_eius Wrote: I've noticed that even people who smoke marijuana occasionally go through great difficulty when they try to give it up.  If it's not physically addictive, it is emotionally.  It happens so quickly, and the effect itself makes a person deny their dependence on it.  I've seen literally countless people go quite crazy when the stuff wasn't available for weeks at a time.  People who use it 'recreationally' usually have anger problems.  I've known people to start smoking crack just because there was no marijuana around.  Making it legal wouldn't help a person like this avoid sin, because the problem itself is in the emotional dependence.

Do you suppose the anger problems come from the pot, or is the pot covering up the anger problems?  Is the pot the cause or the crutch in your experience?

I don't know.  But either way, it seems obvious to me that it's avoiding dealing with the anger.  I've noticed it stunts people's emotional and spiritual growth.  I don't know how it couldn't.

From what I have seen, the major issue with marijuana's stunting action is when it is regularly consumed when the person smoking it is very young.  Their teens.   That is when people learn to 'be adults' about their anger and sort out issues and learn patience.  Any drug taken recreationaly at that age tends to do so.  It gets a person stuck at that age.  Booze too.  That is why I believe that regular intoxication of any sort at a young age is a bad bad idea.  As an adult though, a person has already learned how to deal with their emotions like an adult (theoretically anyway) and such intoxicants can be used in moderation with much much less worry about causing emotional dependency.

I have seen the effects on a person at both stages, the person who started consuming as an adult is very much a recreational consumer, and rarely at that, while the person who started smoking as a young teen does indeed have anger issues.  Hard to tell on that one though, as the one who started as a teen has a step-father who was very abusive and passed on *his* anger issues.
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#17
(10-30-2012, 08:52 PM)SouthpawLink Wrote: I would think that the moderate use of narcotics for a sufficient or grave reason would be morally licit.  The only reason/condition for it to become would be a prohibition by positive law, which is what we have now.

Narcotics are allowed for pain control, under strict guidance of a doctor.  The assumption is that the doctor is virtuous, though, which isn't always the case, but that's a different matter.
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#18
(10-30-2012, 08:51 PM)SaintRafael Wrote:
(10-30-2012, 08:42 PM)knittycat Wrote: Tobacco is food oriented? Since when?

Tobacco was made for common consumption. Tobacco can used regularly, it be moderated, and used as part of sobriety. Tobacco is not a drug. Tobacco does not alter your consciousness and impairs reason like the illegitimate use of some drugs.

From what I've seen, tobacco is far far *far* more addictive than pot.  My mom stopped smoking pot when she was in her early twenties no problems, she stopped smoking cigarettes a few years later, and she told me it was the hardest thing she'd ever done.  In my, albeit limited, experience tobacco is a very difficult drug to use in moderation.
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#19
(10-30-2012, 08:58 PM)knittycat Wrote: From what I have seen, the major issue with marijuana's stunting action is when it is regularly consumed when the person smoking it is very young.  Their teens.   That is when people learn to 'be adults' about their anger and sort out issues and learn patience.  Any drug taken recreationaly at that age tends to do so.  It gets a person stuck at that age.  Booze too.  That is why I believe that regular intoxication of any sort at a young age is a bad bad idea.  As an adult though, a person has already learned how to deal with their emotions like an adult (theoretically anyway) and such intoxicants can be used in moderation with much much less worry about causing emotional dependency.

I have seen the effects on a person at both stages, the person who started consuming as an adult is very much a recreational consumer, and rarely at that, while the person who started smoking as a young teen does indeed have anger issues.  Hard to tell on that one though, as the one who started as a teen has a step-father who was very abusive and passed on *his* anger issues.

Hopefully even old people can grow in virtue!
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#20
(10-30-2012, 09:04 PM)knittycat Wrote:
(10-30-2012, 08:51 PM)SaintRafael Wrote:
(10-30-2012, 08:42 PM)knittycat Wrote: Tobacco is food oriented? Since when?

Tobacco was made for common consumption. Tobacco can used regularly, it be moderated, and used as part of sobriety. Tobacco is not a drug. Tobacco does not alter your consciousness and impairs reason like the illegitimate use of some drugs.

From what I've seen, tobacco is far far *far* more addictive than pot.  My mom stopped smoking pot when she was in her early twenties no problems, she stopped smoking cigarettes a few years later, and she told me it was the hardest thing she'd ever done.  In my, albeit limited, experience tobacco is a very difficult drug to use in moderation.

Heroin addicts who also smoke cigarettes report that quitting tobacco was harder than quitting heroin.
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