Transubstantiation in modern science: How can substance change without accidents
(12-06-2012, 03:30 PM)jim111 Wrote:
(12-06-2012, 02:21 PM)jim111 Wrote: Does that help?

Perhaps answering this question will help with my understanding. 

"Transubstantiation differs from every other substantial conversion in this, that only the substance is converted into another — the accidents remaining the same — just as would be the case if wood were miraculously converted into iron, the substance of the iron remaining hidden under the external appearance of the wood."

In this senario, if it is not the changing of molecular structure that defines substance then what determines the substance of something?
If it is not the molecular structure, then what reason to we have to believe that there is something else that makes wood, wood?
A plant grows form soil into wood. How do we know that the wood substance is not actually dirt with rock accidents?
If we cant detect substances then how could anyone know they exist? How do we know if we are changing substances, or if everything is the same substance with different accidents? How do we know the priest is not concerting something with the accidents of bread but substance of something else?

Perhaps my problem is my understanding of substance, I have read new advents description and it did not help me with this problem.

The distinction between substance and accidents is from Aristotle. The idea is that there is something fundamentally there, which is related to but not the same as the accidents (which we perceive).

The substance is not the accidents but deeper, or inside, or at a smaller level. It's a totally different thing. How do we know molecules even exist? We know from the accidents -- every experiment in the history of chemistry supporting atomic/molecular theory is interpreted by looking at things directly or through instrumental analysis -- all accidents.

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Re: Transubstantiation in modern science: How can substance change without accidents - by newyorkcatholic - 12-06-2012, 03:57 PM

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