Statistics needed for decline of church but can't be from sspx site
#21
http://cara.georgetown.edu/
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#22
The Catholic Church is growing in Africa, parts of Asia, China, but as some of the previous posts point out, we still have our work cut out for us. The problems of poor cateechesis and unbelief by the leadership are challenges. The question is how do we repond to those challenges? We can curse the darkness or we can light a candle.   
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#23
(01-01-2013, 01:14 AM)Poche Wrote: The Catholic Church is growing in Africa, parts of Asia, China, but as some of the previous posts point out, we still have our work cut out for us. The problems of poor cateechesis and unbelief by the leadership are challenges. The question is how do we repond to those challenges? We can curse the darkness or we can light a candle.   

Or we can hide our candle under a basket.  Or fall asleep and our lamps run out of oil and we get locked out of the wedding.  Those are also options.
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#24
(12-31-2012, 11:31 AM)ggreg Wrote:
(12-31-2012, 09:32 AM)The Dying Flutchman Wrote: You could always google "belief in the real presence among Catholics" or something similar. A study came out a few years back that only 47 percent believe in the real presence making them essentially heretics.

Bishop Fellay in a recent talk said 70 percent of Novus Ordo priests did not believe in the real presence, if I heard him right.
This was a specific diocese in Germany. I think worldwide the number would be lower.
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#25
(12-31-2012, 02:30 PM)Scotus Wrote:
(12-31-2012, 07:45 AM)ggreg Wrote:
(12-31-2012, 06:57 AM)Poche Wrote: Nigeria, Cameroon, The Democratic Republic of the Congo, Togo, Ghana, in fact most of Sub-Saharan Africa.

Since men have multiple wives and girlfriends and Catholic priests often have female partners in those countries, then it should hardly come as a surprise that it is growing.  Do a little research and you'll discover the situation there is pretty sordid.

I have heard of men attending Mass in company with wife and mistress with no reproach from the priest.
When the Church was growing in Europe in early medieval times, the situation was not much different.
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#26
(01-01-2013, 01:14 AM)Poche Wrote: The Catholic Church is growing in Africa, parts of Asia, China, but as some of the previous posts point out, we still have our work cut out for us. The problems of poor cateechesis and unbelief by the leadership are challenges. The question is how do we repond to those challenges? We can curse the darkness or we can light a candle.   

False dichotomy - do both.  Except replace "darkness" with "heretic bishops" and "candle" with .

Do it...click the link  :grin:
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#27
(01-01-2013, 01:14 AM)Poche Wrote: The Catholic Church is growing in Africa, parts of Asia, China, but as some of the previous posts point out, we still have our work cut out for us. The problems of poor cateechesis and unbelief by the leadership are challenges.

Zero credibility is another challenge.  If my new local bishop issued a letter in my African parish telling me to give up my mistress I would Google him and when I found he, or his boss in Rome or many of his equivalents where implicated in the cover up of clerical sex abuse on minors I would just ignore them.

The homosexual subculture of the Church is not going to score any points with modern Africans who have Internet access and can read as well as you and I.

You need a Cure of Ars type of priest to turn that sort of deeply ingrained culture around.  Or a miracle from God.
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#28
Or we could end up with married priests, making the Africans right all along.  Unlike other tinkering with the priesthood, married priests are not a case of can vs. can't but should vs. shouldn't.  The Church can (and in fact does) ordain married men.
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#29
(01-01-2013, 07:05 AM)Freudentaumel Wrote:
(12-31-2012, 02:30 PM)Scotus Wrote:
(12-31-2012, 07:45 AM)ggreg Wrote:
(12-31-2012, 06:57 AM)Poche Wrote: Nigeria, Cameroon, The Democratic Republic of the Congo, Togo, Ghana, in fact most of Sub-Saharan Africa.

Since men have multiple wives and girlfriends and Catholic priests often have female partners in those countries, then it should hardly come as a surprise that it is growing.  Do a little research and you'll discover the situation there is pretty sordid.

I have heard of men attending Mass in company with wife and mistress with no reproach from the priest.

When the Church was growing in Europe in early medieval times, the situation was not much different.

Paging Charlemagne...Blessed Charlemagne....
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#30
(01-03-2013, 07:41 AM)Allan Wrote: Or we could end up with married priests, making the Africans right all along.  Unlike other tinkering with the priesthood, married priests are not a case of can vs. can't but should vs. shouldn't.  The Church can (and in fact does) ordain married men.

Except I dont think the priests are marrying them over there.
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