Fr. Z's Thoughts on Pope's First Mass
#21
And back to the Mass:

Of course he said it in Latin.  It was a Mass for 115 cardinals from around the world.  What other language could he have used that wouldn't have offended somebody?  Using Latin, he offended everybody.  QED

Now, back to UFC, FE version....   :jabs:
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#22
(03-14-2013, 08:13 PM)dark lancer Wrote:
(03-14-2013, 08:11 PM)Lateran15 Wrote:
(03-14-2013, 08:03 PM)dark lancer Wrote:
(03-14-2013, 08:00 PM)Lateran15 Wrote:
(03-14-2013, 07:54 PM)dark lancer Wrote:
(03-14-2013, 07:54 PM)Lateran15 Wrote:
(03-14-2013, 07:53 PM)dark lancer Wrote: Is there another Pope Emeritus?

There is no such title.

So you are Orthodox or Protestant?

I hope this is a poor attempt at humor.  Your post is utter offensive.

So have been yours.

How dare you call me a heretic.

Your words, not mine.

Sound and fury.

Respond forthwith to my PM response to your PM.
I demand an apology.
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#23
If you please, could you guys continue this in PM, then do the public apologies later?
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#24
(03-14-2013, 06:13 PM)ggreg Wrote: In my experience leopards don't change their spots.

We've been through this optimism and hopium overdosing with JP2.  There was no internet back then, no dirt on the guy, and absolutely no reason not to think a Polish Cardinal who had to deal with Commies would not be an EXCELLENT Pope and a friend of Traditionalists.  Hardline SSPX Trads were super-excited about his appointment.  I was 11 and I remember it well.   My mother put a large picture of him up in our dining room.  We all know how that turned out.

Then we had B16 who had 25 years in the Curia and knew where all the skeletons were buried.  The Rottweiler, God's Rottweiler.  The German Shepherd.  Turned out to be like the Lion in the Wizard of Oz.  90% of Trads were still excited when he was appointed.

Now we have a man who kneels down to be prayed over by Protestants, has Pinocchio and Tow Town Children's Masses with happy clappg crappy dancers, has restricted the TLM in his own diocese and celebrates Hannukah by praying with Jews and Pagans.  And this is just what we discovered in the first 24 hours.

If I jump to conclusions, they are jumped at with 30 years of seeing what people with less dirt under their fingernails actually did as Pope.

The definition of madness is doing the same thing and expecting a different result.

Excellent post!
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#25
(03-14-2013, 05:40 PM)rbjmartin Wrote: Video of the Mass is here:


With all due respect, he seemed like a man out of his element. His plain mitre seems out of place (looks to be the same one used at this Missa de Ninos (see around the 13 minute mark):


And he seems to not know what to do with someone with the liturgical expertise of Guido Marini at his right hand. His Latin doesn't seem all that hot (he seemed to stumble through the Confiteor, and when he gave the final blessing, he put "Holy Spirit" in the genitive when it should have been nominative), and he didn't even use the Roman Canon. Liturgically, I am not optimistic, unless he has the humility to receive the liturgical advice and direction of Monsignor Marini.

Also, Fr. Z appeared to quote him incorrectly. The quote from the sermon was: "When one does not profess Jesus Christ - I recall the phrase of Leon Bloy – 'Whoever does not pray to God, prays to the devil.' When one does not profess Jesus Christ, one professes the worldliness of the devil."
Not quite as strong as Fr. Z made it out to be. It does leave some wiggle room if one wants to be an ecumaniac. Still, it's a strong and laudable statement.
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#26
(03-14-2013, 05:02 PM)Might_4_Right Wrote: [Image: 20130314-171348.jpg]

It is always sad to see an versus populum altar in front of something so grand.



Source

My thought exactly.
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#27
(03-14-2013, 07:34 PM)Might_4_Right Wrote: I'm on board with the Holy Father's stance on moral issues and I'm inspired by his personal holiness, but I think, as traditionalists, we're in for a rough ride when it comes to his approach to the liturgy and what looks like a lack of understanding for the importance of the dignity of Petrine office. For me, this is not a sign of humility but the lack thereof because, as rbjmartin mentioned, those dignities are not really his to do away with.  They belong to the Petrine office, that rock the Church is built on and which the gates of hell will not destroy. To me, he is my Holy Father and my Vicar of Christ, even if he would prefer I call him Jorge.

After seeing his first Mass I have little hope he will be a liturgical Pope.  At best he will ignore the traditional mass, but maybe that will make him more disposed to regularize the SSPX because he just doesn't care.  Who knows?  :shrug:
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#28
(03-14-2013, 06:13 PM)ggreg Wrote: In my experience leopards don't change their spots.

We've been through this optimism and hopium overdosing with JP2.  There was no internet back then, no dirt on the guy, and absolutely no reason not to think a Polish Cardinal who had to deal with Commies would not be an EXCELLENT Pope and a friend of Traditionalists.  Hardline SSPX Trads were super-excited about his appointment.  I was 11 and I remember it well.   My mother put a large picture of him up in our dining room.  We all know how that turned out.

Then we had B16 who had 25 years in the Curia and knew where all the skeletons were buried.  The Rottweiler, God's Rottweiler.  The German Shepherd.  Turned out to be like the Lion in the Wizard of Oz.  90% of Trads were still excited when he was appointed.

Now we have a man who kneels down to be prayed over by Protestants, has Pinocchio and Tow Town Children's Masses with happy clappg crappy dancers, has restricted the TLM in his own diocese and celebrates Hannukah by praying with Jews and Pagans.  And this is just what we discovered in the first 24 hours.

If I jump to conclusions, they are jumped at with 30 years of seeing what people with less dirt under their fingernails actually did as Pope.

The definition of madness is doing the same thing and expecting a different result.

I agree with you a lot.
Pope F has a lived a very good life and we should appreciate his works and humility.

However, his job is to stand up to the wolves and clean house. For a soft spoken milquetoast of a man, I don't see that possible.
We need a strong father who can deliver tough love for our own good.

Seeing him in those pagan, jew, satanic or otherwise religion ceremonies is sickening. Sets a poor example. Being charitable is nice, but being apart of another's false worship is showing that you respect them as an equal.
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