Anglican more Catholic than Francis
#31
(06-16-2013, 09:58 AM)Tim Wrote: That's the point they the SSPX are not everywhere. They also have a streak of "sede:" in them and I for one can not abide that. So where do we go ?

Well, I didn't start this thread in order to give practical advice on where to assist at Holy Mass or access the sacraments.  I merely wanted to produce a bit of realism about Francis's ideas.

But I will say that if you are going to rule out the SSPX, as you do, on the basis of a "streak" of something you probably don't understand, you might well find yourself having to choose amongst pretty unCatholic alternatives.

(06-16-2013, 09:58 AM)Tim Wrote: What is the solution ? Does Bishop Fellay have the authority, as Bishop Lefevbre has said; do not got to the NO Mass. No, neither have that authority.

No authority is required for us to know that we cannot assist at a non-Catholic service.

And in any case, a cursory examination of the text with which the New Mass was ordered published by Paul VI reveals that it did not permit any priest to use the new missal, let alone make it compulsory, so we have no right to assist at it.  Quo Primum remains the law.

(06-16-2013, 09:58 AM)Tim Wrote: More these postings of yours imply we are blind to these problems and are all Assissi types.  We are not. 

I have been quite precise.  I don't think you're Assisi types at all. Re-read what I have written.  I think you're Catholics who have a completely false understanding of what the Church actually is (and I don't blame you for this, in the circumstances - what a mess it is!).  This is quite different from the neo-Protestants who love the novelties of the Vatican II revolt.  Such people are not even Catholics - they don't share our faith, and they glory in not sharing it.  Look at Francis's recent comments on a rosary bouquet he was presented.  So ridiculous did he regard it that he had to tell people "don't laugh!"
Reply
#32
Okay I get it now. The SSPX, and a few others, are Catholicism and the rest are not, so we are either Aposatates or Protestants.

Have a nice day.

tim
Reply
#33
(06-16-2013, 10:49 AM)Tim Wrote: Okay I get it now. The SSPX, and a few others, are Catholicism and the rest are not, so we are either Aposatates or Protestants.

Have a nice day.

tim

Don't worry Tim, you can always become Anglican. Thanks to this thread I have seen the error of my ways. I make my conversion to true Catholicism (Anglicanism) tomorrow.

Anglicans & SSPX communion= Catholics
Francis communion = non-Catholic

Extra SSPX nulla salus.

Having said that I must say that I have volunteered to become a Bishop as per the request of Bishop Williamson in the latest Kyrie Eleison so if you wait a few months you may join my communion (I have the real Catholicism).
Reply
#34
(06-16-2013, 10:49 AM)Tim Wrote: Okay I get it now. The SSPX, and a few others, are Catholicism and the rest are not, so we are either Aposatates or Protestants.

Have a nice day.
Mate, however you want to write off the challenge, you do so.  :)

Do you really consider Roger Mahony to be a Catholic?

You're not a Catholic if you don't profess the Catholic faith.  This much is fundamental, and not disputable.  If the hat fits, wear it, although I suspect strongly that it doesn't fit at all.  What I guess is going on is that you want to be thought of as wearing the same hat as Francis, because you think you must, so...

Anyway, it just shows what folly you get to when you try and hold contradictory ideas.  He's not a Catholic, and you are.  Try not to shoot the messenger.
Reply
#35
(06-16-2013, 06:45 AM)John Lane Wrote: He preaches the faith?  Tell me where and when this happened.  I only hear naturalism.

Why waste my time ? Your mind is made up.

Reply
#36
(06-16-2013, 11:22 AM)John Lane Wrote: You're not a Catholic if you don't profess the Catholic faith.  This much is fundamental, and not disputable.  

Every Roman Catholic I know of who goes to Mass professes the Faith at every Mass at which the Creed is recited. Even the NO Mass flock does it. Same Creed(s) as in the pre VII days. Not a word changed.

So, when H.H. Francis recites the Creed at Mass he's not Catholic ?
Reply
#37
(06-16-2013, 07:11 AM)Vincentius Wrote: Basta!  For SV's, the Petrine Office closed with the death of Pope Pius XII.  To them there will be no more Popes after him.  (There is even one fella who has come to reveal that the truly last valid Pope was Pio Nono -- Bl. Pius IX.  Nothing but musings of an infirm Catholic mind).

How can there be?  The Apostolic succession has been cut off and the validity of the electors of the papacy has become doubtful, according to them. This seems not only second-guessing the mind of Christ but also a perversion of His words, "... behold I am with you all days, even to the consummation of the world."   To second-guess the mind of Christ is to say, they know that Christ has not said, "So you elected Francis.   For now he is My pope."   Do we think that Christ has not acknowledged the last Conclave?

Dialogue of St. Catherine of Siena with God the Father:
Quote:God the Father:  And to Who did my Son give the Keys of His Blood?
St. Catherine:  To Peter.
God the Father:  Yes, to Peter and his successors until the end of time.

So the Bloodline ends when?

Not all sedes believe that Pope Pius XII was the last pope or even that Paul VI wasn't validly elected and even legitimately held the papacy for some period of time. Show just what you really know.
Reply
#38
(06-16-2013, 04:17 PM)Whitey Wrote:
(06-16-2013, 11:22 AM)John Lane Wrote: You're not a Catholic if you don't profess the Catholic faith.  This much is fundamental, and not disputable.  

Every Roman Catholic I know of who goes to Mass professes the Faith at every Mass at which the Creed is recited. Even the NO Mass flock does it. Same Creed(s) as in the pre VII days. Not a word changed.

So, when H.H. Francis recites the Creed at Mass he's not Catholic ?

Look, it's not a question of whether somebody ever says anything Catholic - even the entire Creed.  The Greeks use the entire Creed and manage not to believe it, and they profess their refusal to believe quite publicly.  Likewise the Anglicans, yet they hold countless grave errors directly against the faith.  And actually, despite their profession fo the Creed (which has indeed changed, the "I believe" being replaced by "We believe"), in the Novus Ordo milieu there's plenty of manifest heresy.  When somebody takes a consecrated host and turns it over in his hand playfully, eventually pops it into his mouth as he wanders back to his pew whilst staring at the "talent," doesn't even check to see if any crumbs remain on his hands, and proceeds to chew with a half-open mouth whilst chatting to his neighbour, the only realistic judgement is that he has no belief in the Real Presence.  Surveys confirm this already clear impression.

Nor is it a matter of "catching somebody out" on an error here or there.  It's a question of the whole picture.  Stand back and ask whether that individual professes the Catholic Faith, or whether thre picture adds up to something else.  Francis is manifestly a neo-Modernist.  It's in everything he does - his dress, his associations (this is a man whose only published book was co-authored with a rabbi), his language, his liturgical practices, his words. 

His only serious concern is for the poor, not with any supernatural aspect either, in direct contrast to Our Lord's reply to the theology of Judas, "The poor you always have with you."

<< And when Jesus was in Bethania, in the house of Simon the leper, There came to him a woman having an alabaster box of precious ointment, and poured it on his head as he was at table. And the disciples seeing it, had indignation, saying: To what purpose is this waste? For this might have been sold for much, and given to the poor. And Jesus knowing it, said to them: Why do you trouble this woman? for she hath wrought a good work upon me.

For the poor you have always with you: but me you have not always. >>

The dignity with which Our Lord Jesus Christ is treated in the liturgy is a direct parallel with this passage.  The Catholic Church has always taken the greatest pains to ensure that He is treated as King.  Catholics instinctively feel that this is their first duty.  Everything about the Novus Ordo milieu is a standing denial of this principle.  If you cannot see this, you're wrong-headed yourself and you need to take some remedial action on your own faith before you go the way of MOST of those who went along with the Novus Ordo programme - they lost their faith entirely as a result.  Yes, most.  The remnant is actually a minority of what was there in 1965, despite the increase in the absolute number (of nominal Catholics) through population growth.
Reply
#39
OldMan, then he is not a true SV whoever you are referring to.  There are a myriad of theological theories about  who is not Pope.  The "purist" sede states that the Chair of Peter is unoccupied because he has already determined the factors that make a true pope are lacking or defective.  Or he would not be an SV.  I don't hold John Lane a true sede, at least for now, as I have known him since at least more than a few dozen years,  and that he attends the SSPX speaks a lot.  At least before you judge what I really do know check first if you are clearly in the know.  Thanks.
Reply
#40
(06-16-2013, 08:42 PM)Vincentius Wrote: OldMan, then he is not a true SV whoever you are referring to.  There are a myriad of theological theories about  who is not Pope.  The "purist" sede states that the Chair of Peter is unoccupied because he has already determined the factors that make a true pope are lacking or defective.  Or he would not be an SV.  I don't hold John Lane a true sede, at least for now, as I have known him since at least more than a few dozen years,  and that he attends the SSPX speaks a lot.  At least before you judge what I really do know check first if you are clearly in the know.  Thanks.

Who cares what you think? I know John Lane too – and quite well at that! There is no such thing as a "purist" sede. Probably only exists in your mind.

Q. Do  you consider yourself a "purist" sede? If so, where does one go to get the "purist" seal of approval?
Reply




Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)