‘We need the pedophile’: Child-love sympathizer to keynote conference at Univers
#11
Give it 20 years and NAMBLA will be a legitimate group and child sex will be legal. I suppose snuff porn and bestiality will be final frontier after that. Hopefully our Lord returns long before then. Pray for the second coming. I know I will.
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#12
(10-16-2013, 12:20 AM)RedCaves Wrote: I've always thought that it is a Universal constant that is forbidden and condemned, like incest.

Even incest is not '(A) Universal constant that is forbidden and condemned...' In ancient Egypt the Pharaohs regularly practised half-brother/half-sister marriages. The Pharaoh could have many wives, but at least one had to be his half-sister  and his successor had to come from that union.
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#13
This is interesting. I disagree with what the academic is saying in principle, however the scapegoating rituals (as a way of never coming to terms with pedophiles as human beings) is interesting. Channeled in another direction, this research could tell us a lot more about our reactions to molestation and a way of reconciling that revulsion with the deformation of the perpetrator's sexuality (and the trauma inflicted on their victims). The sexualization of the child, with childhood as a concept that's deeply rooted in the Victorian period, does seem to be quite central.
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#14
(10-16-2013, 04:45 AM)loggats Wrote: This is interesting. I disagree with what the academic is saying in principle, however the scapegoating rituals (as a way of never coming to terms with pedophiles as human beings) is interesting. Channeled in another direction, this research could tell us a lot more about our reactions to molestation and a way of reconciling that revulsion with the deformation of the perpetrator's sexuality (and the trauma inflicted on their victims). The sexualization of the child, with childhood as a concept that's deeply rooted in the Victorian period, does seem to be quite central.

I am so glad you post here. I just got done telling someone in a PM how thoughtful and intelligent I think you are. And it's so.

Yes, "even" pedophiles are human beings, their warped, destructive sexuality not being something they chose. They can sin in feeding those impulses (child porn, etc.) or, God forbid, acting on them, but they are human beings in the end, with severely distorted, extremely disordered sexualities. I would never leave a known pedophile alone with any child, but I hope I'd be charitable toward one if I were in his/her company.

That researcher, though, seems to use his "research" for nefarious ends ("all adults are secretly sexually attracted to children "? Really?! " or "We need the pedophile to fill our emptiness, provide the matter we otherwise miss, create our own form of existence" -- say what?) and doesn't seem to have the will to fight his inclinations, instead, trying to justify or excuse them, make them "normal." Kids would not be safe around him, and that he's allowed basically propagandize for accepting acting on pedophiliac impulses is revolting.
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#15
And the elephant in the room is undoubtedly the issue of desire itself, and the fact that the expression of desire in a chaste context has been deemed impossible (and actually unhealthy!) by many people. I don't think it's an exaggeration to say that this is because of the "pop Freud" that we've internalized as a Western culture, somehow equating sublimation with something negative and dangerous. Not so at all. If we really understood Freud (who was thwarted yes, because he saw no eschatological goal for eros, but that doesn't invalidate him entirely) then we would acknowledge sublimation as something necessary to civilisation - it stops us from being total beasts and allows creativity, the pursuit of knowledge etc as a focus for our passions. This redirection, in conformity with Christ (we just have to look at St Paul's theology of the Cross) as members of His Church, is the healing mechanism we've been denied for too long. Our culture is obsessed with desire - buy this, lust after that, covet and eat and possess. But the one true desire, which is a lifelong journey and orientation towards the mystery of the Trinity, has been completely obscured. We need to talk about VIRTUE, and then this kind of stuff will fall by the wayside as so much dreck (an academic curiosity) and not a source of consternation or (God forbid) a launching pad for serious discussion about the normalization of pedophilia.

Whenever I look at academic texts (I'm in the humanities) I usually ask myself "Where is Christ in this?" and I'm sure that's the perspective we all strive to have as Catholics in our lives.
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#16
The term "pedophile" has been used rather loosely by the media and people in general. A pedophile is someone who has a primary or exclusive sexual interest in a children who are prepubescent.

What most people see happening and find disgusted is sexual acts with children who have reached puberty. The terms to describe these kind of people are hebephilia or ephebophilia.

Of course any sexual act outside of marriage is wrong, however, I think sometimes it may just be that extramarital act and not the young age in and itself that is the sin. From what I understand, the Church teaches to obey local laws in regards to getting married. Some countries, children can get married as young as 12 legally.

The Church has its own minimum age requirements which must be met before a marriage takes place:

"Can.  1083 §1. A man before he has completed his sixteenth year of age and a woman before she has completed her fourteenth year of age cannot enter into a valid marriage."

So a man must be at least 16 and a woman at least 14 before they can get married.

Surely a 14 year old woman marrying a 40 year old man is not pedophilia? Sure it would seem odd, but not sinful?

Haven't scholars come to an estimate of the Blessed Virgin Mary's age at the Annunciation 12 -14? Also, wasn't Joseph said to be old when he got married to the BVM? It seems it was the norm then and still is in some parts of the world.

Just some food for thought.
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#17
(10-16-2013, 11:46 PM)Slayer Wrote: Surely a 14 year old woman marrying a 40 year old man is not pedophilia? Sure it would seem odd, but not sinful?

I guess *technically* it is not a sin.  But if I had a daughter and that was the situation, I'd have to make sure my daughter was constantly surrounded by a pack of VERY protective Dobermans.
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#18
(10-16-2013, 06:06 PM)loggats Wrote: And the elephant in the room is undoubtedly the issue of desire itself, and the fact that the expression of desire in a chaste context has been deemed impossible (and actually unhealthy!) by many people. I don't think it's an exaggeration to say that this is because of the "pop Freud" that we've internalized as a Western culture, somehow equating sublimation with something negative and dangerous. Not so at all. If we really understood Freud (who was thwarted yes, because he saw no eschatological goal for eros, but that doesn't invalidate him entirely) then we would acknowledge sublimation as something necessary to civilisation - it stops us from being total beasts and allows creativity, the pursuit of knowledge etc as a focus for our passions. This redirection, in conformity with Christ (we just have to look at St Paul's theology of the Cross) as members of His Church, is the healing mechanism we've been denied for too long. Our culture is obsessed with desire - buy this, lust after that, covet and eat and possess. But the one true desire, which is a lifelong journey and orientation towards the mystery of the Trinity, has been completely obscured. We need to talk about VIRTUE, and then this kind of stuff will fall by the wayside as so much dreck (an academic curiosity) and not a source of consternation or (God forbid) a launching pad for serious discussion about the normalization of pedophilia.

Whenever I look at academic texts (I'm in the humanities) I usually ask myself "Where is Christ in this?" and I'm sure that's the perspective we all strive to have as Catholics in our lives.

Amen. Your post brings to mind some stuff I remember reading in Allan Bloom's "The Closing of the American Mind." I made some images from Google Books:

[Image: tcotam1.jpg]


After talking to students about the necessity for sublimation and repression, etc., for civilization, he writes, [I will never]
[Image: tcotam2.jpg]

You wrote, "And the elephant in the room is undoubtedly the issue of desire itself, and the fact that the expression of desire in a chaste context has been deemed impossible (and actually unhealthy!) by many people.":  think about how hideously true that is! To contrast a world in which that is true with a world in which it was seen as a given that chastity matters, that the sexual act has a deep meaning and biological purpose, when scads of books were written for children about the importance of virtue -- it's to see how so far we've fallen. And so quickly, too. And so completely.

Whattaworld...
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#19
(10-17-2013, 12:04 AM)Chestertonian Wrote:
(10-16-2013, 11:46 PM)Slayer Wrote: Surely a 14 year old woman marrying a 40 year old man is not pedophilia? Sure it would seem odd, but not sinful?

I guess *technically* it is not a sin.  But if I had a daughter and that was the situation, I'd have to make sure my daughter was constantly surrounded by a pack of VERY protective older brothers and uncles.

Fixed that typo.  Sticking tongue out at you

14 are 40 would be considered extreme even in the Middle Ages.
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