Illinois credits Francis for push for same sex "marriage"
#1
No comment ...

Words have consequences

No, the Pope's words on homosexuality do not change the doctrine of the Church, and in no way excuse what these 'lawmakers' have done. At the same time, this does not bode well for those who have argued that the Pope's strategy of putting the accent almost exclusively on inclusion and compassion will do little harm to the Church, while miraculously attracting large numbers back to the faith.

From the Christian Science Monitor article "As Illinois House approves gay marriage, speaker cites Pope Francis":


After months of false starts, the Illinois House of Representatives on Tuesday voted to legalize same-sex marriage, and Pope Francis's recent comments about homosexuality may have played a small but significant role, reports suggest.

At least one Catholic lawmaker cited the pope's statement as she explained her recent decision, and Speaker of the House Michael Madigan, also a Catholic, used the pope's words to articulate his own reasons for supporting the bill. Previously, he had been criticized for not pushing hard enough to rally support for the bill. Other factors played into the shift that made passage through the House possible Tuesday, including two US Supreme Court decisions this summer in favor of gay marriage, reports suggest. But with polls showing public opinion moving toward greater acceptance of gay marriage, the events in Illinois raise questions about whether opposition among Catholic lawmakers could be waning.

Pope Francis caused international ripples in July, when he warned that the Roman Catholic Church had become too focused on its opposition to homosexuality, asking, "If a person is gay and seeks God and has good will, who am I to judge him?" 

At that point, the Illinois bill had passed through the state Senate but was languishing in the House. The House convened in both January and May without voting on the bill, as its supporters struggled to assemble a majority amid a tide of organized opposition, with churches among the leading opponents.

But according to The Chicago Tribune, Pope Francis' comments "sparked a wave of soul-searching by several Catholic lawmakers who had battled to reconcile their religious beliefs with their sworn duty to represent their constituents who were increasingly supportive of gay rights even as Cardinal Francis George remained opposed."

State Rep. Linda Chapa LaVia (D), who had spent much of the summer undecided, voted for the bill on Tuesday, telling the Tribune, "As a Catholic follower of Jesus and the pope, Pope Francis, I am clear that our Catholic religious doctrine has at its core love, compassion, and justice for all people."


And House Speaker Madigan (D) echoed the Pope's words in the Tribune, adding a legal twist: "For those that just happen to be gay – living in a very harmonious, productive relationship but illegal – who am I to judge that they should be illegal?" 

Though he was an early supporter of the bill, his commitment to it had been question. But on Tuesday, advocates told the Tribune that he had been instrumental in rounding up the needed votes in recent weeks – and Madigan told the paper that he had personally helped persuade at least five legislators to support it.

Source: Rorate Caeli http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2013/11...ences.html

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#2
I live there and they're using Pope Francis as foil. Like the rest of the progressive world no one cares if homosexuals marry, these folks can't search their souls it's too dark. Not too long ago Chicagoland was considered a lost county of Ireland the comical line was calling it County Cook with a brogue. I sent an email around to my closet old pals (most no longer practice) telling them this is the last sin which cries to heaven for God's vengeance, being enshrined in law. I warned them the Chastisement of God can not be too long from today. In the day the Irish pols like da Mayor would make news by taking the entire family to the Stations of the Cross on Good Friday, not today anymore.

tim
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#3
Did anyone expect anything different?

There are consequences to what one says. Notice there was no clarification from Francis... on this issue or the big NARL thank you. it's a calculated move to confuse and disorient – just like the rest of Vatican II's teachings.
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#4
(11-07-2013, 11:08 AM)Tim Wrote: I live there and they're using Pope Francis as foil. Like the rest of the progressive world no one cares if homosexuals marry, these folks can't search their souls it's too dark. Not too long ago Chicagoland was considered a lost county of Ireland the comical line was calling it County Cook with a brogue. I sent an email around to my closet old pals (most no longer practice) telling them this is the last sin which cries to heaven for God's vengeance, being enshrined in law. I warned them the Chastisement of God can not be too long from today. In the day the Irish pols like da Mayor would make news by taking the entire family to the Stations of the Cross on Good Friday, not today anymore.

tim

I used to be of the mindset that the Pope should not be held responsible if someone misinterprets something that he says. How can he be blamed for their stupidity?

But after reading this article, it's now clear that ambiguity and/or political correctness are just as much to blame as misunderstanding is.

If the statements and time line in this article are true, this should be a wake up call for every politically correct clergy member. Its obvious that anything but bluntness and directness will be used for ill intentions.
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#5
I'm from Illinois....

It will be a very interesting to see what things have changed when I return.
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#6
Did anyone expect anything different?
There are consequences to what one says. Notice there was no clarification from Francis... on this issue or the big NARL thank you. it's a calculated move to confuse and disorient – just like the rest of Vatican II's teachings.


This happened in spite of Bishop Thomas John Paprocki noble efforts. Here is one of the few areas where the sheep are getting leadership from their  Bishop. I honestly believe that without Pope Francis' comments this battle may have been won in Illinois. The father of lies must be smiling from ear to ear right now.      Most Sacred Heart of Jesus have mercy on us
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#7
As Pope St. Pius X would stress, "Like pastor, like flock." (cf. the opening of Pascendi).
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#8
(11-07-2013, 11:59 AM)damooster Wrote:
(11-07-2013, 11:08 AM)Tim Wrote: I live there and they're using Pope Francis as foil. Like the rest of the progressive world no one cares if homosexuals marry, these folks can't search their souls it's too dark. Not too long ago Chicagoland was considered a lost county of Ireland the comical line was calling it County Cook with a brogue. I sent an email around to my closet old pals (most no longer practice) telling them this is the last sin which cries to heaven for God's vengeance, being enshrined in law. I warned them the Chastisement of God can not be too long from today. In the day the Irish pols like da Mayor would make news by taking the entire family to the Stations of the Cross on Good Friday, not today anymore.

tim

I used to be of the mindset that the Pope should not be held responsible if someone misinterprets something that he says. How can he be blamed for their stupidity?

But after reading this article, it's now clear that ambiguity and/or political correctness are just as much to blame as misunderstanding is.

If the statements and time line in this article are true, this should be a wake up call for every politically correct clergy member. Its obvious that anything but bluntness and directness will be used for ill intentions.

There is also this. The Popes for the last fifty years have been heard through a filter. Go back to 2010 in Buenos Aires and read what then Cardinal Bergoglio said on this very subject. We know we can not trust most of the secular news media, why do we think the others aren't the same ??  In fact as I said I sent the email and I'm now in an embroglio over this very same thing in emails.  Here's the Buenos Aires Herald.

http://www.buenosairesherald.com/Breakin...View/38707

Here's another.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/parker-mar...62581.html

tim
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#9
(11-07-2013, 01:27 PM)Tim Wrote: We know we can not trust most of the secular news media
But on this it seems we can, unless they craftily edited the video of his airplane interview
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#10
(11-07-2013, 01:34 PM)Geremia Wrote:
(11-07-2013, 01:27 PM)Tim Wrote: We know we can not trust most of the secular news media
But on this it seems we can, unless they craftily edited the video of his airplane interview

Which language was it in ?? Italian which he speaks poorly or Spanish ??

tim
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