Pope: Repent or End Up in Hell
#11
(03-22-2014, 01:58 PM)triumphguy Wrote: Don't panic: The Catechism published by Pope Pius X in 1908 defined hell by using the word "state" alone:

Q. 1379. What is Hell?
A. Hell is a state to which the wicked are condemned, and in which they are deprived of the sight of God for all eternity, and are in dreadful torments.

This is also how the Baltimore Catechism #3 defines hell as well.  The definition does not exclude the obvious that these souls (and eventually resurrected bodies) are going to have to be somewhere, i.e. a physical place.  To say that it is not a physical place would be to deny Christ's own words when he said the damed will go "where there shall be weeping and nashing of teeth."
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#12
(03-22-2014, 02:32 PM)PolishTrad Wrote: If Hell is a place, then certainly a very, very untypical one, since it is not physical. But for sure it'll be a place after the Last Judgment.

After the resurrection of the body and the last judgment I would say, yes it is a place.
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#13
(03-22-2014, 02:42 PM)triumphguy Wrote:
(03-22-2014, 02:32 PM)PolishTrad Wrote: If Hell is a place, then certainly a very, very untypical one, since it is not physical. But for sure it'll be a place after the Last Judgment.

After the resurrection of the body and the last judgment I would say, yes it is a place.

If it's not a place now, where are all of the souls of the damned burning in fire?  Where did the Jacinta see the souls falling into at Fatima?  I'm not being cheeky, I think it's an interesting proposition to say hell is not a place (although one a don't subscribe too).  The Baltimore Catechism describes heaven this way:

Q. 1395. What is Heaven?

A. Heaven is the state of everlasting life in which we see God face to face, are made like unto Him in glory, and enjoy eternal happiness.


We know, however, heaven is a place because Our Lord and Our Lady's bodies are already there.
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#14
How can spiritual beings be in a concrete physical place?
"NorthernTrad" Wrote:Where did the Jacinta see the souls falling into at Fatima?
Since we know nothing about the spiritual realm, she might have needed a very graphic visualisation.
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#15
(03-22-2014, 02:45 PM)NorthernTrad Wrote:
(03-22-2014, 02:42 PM)triumphguy Wrote:
(03-22-2014, 02:32 PM)PolishTrad Wrote: If Hell is a place, then certainly a very, very untypical one, since it is not physical. But for sure it'll be a place after the Last Judgment.

After the resurrection of the body and the last judgment I would say, yes it is a place.

If it's not a place now, where are all of the souls of the damned burning in fire?  Where did the Jacinta see the souls falling into at Fatima?  I'm not being cheeky, I think it's an interesting proposition to say hell is not a place (although one a don't subscribe too).  The Baltimore Catechism describes heaven this way:

Q. 1395. What is Heaven?

A. Heaven is the state of everlasting life in which we see God face to face, are made like unto Him in glory, and enjoy eternal happiness.


We know, however, heaven is a place because Our Lord and Our Lady's bodies are already there.

Yes, Mary and Jesus exist in bodily form. Therefore res ipsa loquitur paradise must exist in physical time and space.

However, no-one is yet in hell in bodily form. And souls don't inhabit space or time.

I think the far more important point is:

*the Pope confronts gangsters who purport to be Catholic
*he challenges them to repent and convert or face Hell as a possible consequence.
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#16
I was at a spiritual retreat once where a priest described hell as an actual physical place that is located at the center of the earth. Has anyone heard this before? Is this a  acceptable theological viewpoint or some kind of pious belief of this particular priest?
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#17
Here is the actual video of the homily



It seems that this is so far one of the most stable and solid homilies given by Pope Francis
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#18
(03-23-2014, 12:01 AM)jhfromsf68 Wrote: I was at a spiritual retreat once where a priest described hell as an actual physical place that is located at the center of the earth. Has anyone heard this before? Is this a  acceptable theological viewpoint or some kind of pious belief of this particular priest?
I don't see anything unorthodox here, AFAIK some saints believed so. But what if one day we are able to dig that deep?
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#19
I don't want to be a bit of a negative nancy, but isn't condemning mobsters to hell just politically correct? I mean, the Pope is right, and it is refreshing to hear about hell, but it isn't controversial or anything. Now if the Pope were to say the same thing to those unmarried people living together, or contraceptors, or sodomites...then wake me up and tell me.
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#20
(03-23-2014, 06:46 AM)tridentinist Wrote: I don't want to be a bit of a negative nancy, but isn't condemning mobsters to hell just politically correct? I mean, the Pope is right, and it is refreshing to hear about hell, but it isn't controversial or anything. Now if the Pope were to say the same thing to those unmarried people living together, or contraceptors, or sodomites...then wake me up and tell me.

Maybe it is, but at least there is some acknowledgment that people go to Hell when they do bad things.....now if only we can say sin.
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