Alarming Trend
#11
The parishes that foster poor catechesis and liberal theology are dying off. They literally have no seminarians (much like the convents that have foregone the habits). Priests are these days only coming out of orders that are traditional.

Let me tell you anecdotally, yesterday I took my parents with me to Easter Vigil at a Carmelite parish. When I told them that two of the altar servers were seminarians, they were shocked. I don't think that they had ever seen seminarians before.
Reply
#12
(04-19-2014, 11:52 PM)formerbuddhist Wrote: Ultimately (just to play the devils advocate here) our Lord in His teaching on the Last Judgement does only mention social justice issues, not even belief in Him as a criteria for being saved. If love of God and love of neighbor for the sake of God are the greatest commandments, and if Our Lord speaks about judgment in terms of social justice than ultimately that IS all that matters. That's not what I believe but that's how it's often presented. In my opinion it's a superficial narrow view of scripture and tradition but it's wildly popular and if you're not familiar with the scriptures in the wider sense along with the tradition of the Church it can be convincing to many.

That is interesting. I think it's kinda like the faith/good works debate. The good works is a natural outflow of faith - just like social justice should be the natural outflow of the faith.

In some senses, it's a case of "who is not against us is for us", but with the devil's twist.

Reply
#13
(04-21-2014, 10:24 AM)PrairieMom Wrote: [quote='formerbuddhist' pid='1241498' dateline='1397965959']
Ultimately (just to play the devils advocate here) our Lord in His teaching on the Last Judgement does only mention social justice issues, not even belief in Him as a criteria for being saved. If love of God and love of neighbor for the sake of God are the greatest commandments, and if Our Lord speaks about judgment in terms of social justice than ultimately that IS all that matters. That's not what I believe but that's how it's often presented. In my opinion it's a superficial narrow view of scripture and tradition but it's wildly popular and if you're not familiar with the scriptures in the wider sense along with the tradition of the Church it can be convincing to many.

That is interesting. I think it's kinda like the faith/good works debate. The good works is a natural outflow of faith - just like social justice should be the natural outflow of the faith.

In some senses, it's a case of "who is not against us is for us", but with the devil's twist.

Indeed, and you also have the teaching of Our Lord that "mercy is for the merciful", that we reap what we sow. If we have an immature idea of mercy (as in just live and let live) than we end up thinking that as long as we are simply tolerant and vaguely loving we are doing the work of the Lord. Besides, no one if they are honest wants conflict, and to preach the hard sayings of our Lord would cause conflict; conflicts in parishes, conflicts in communities and conflicts in families. Many priests think that if they just preach love and peace and tolerance they not only will be loved by everyone (thus avoiding conflict) they will be judged favorably because they didn't judge others. Then there is the issue of who is a member of the Church and whether or not there can be salvation outside of the Church. Today, let's face it, many people, including not a few high ranking prelates, appear to believe that anyone in good faith in whatever religion or lack thereof are saved. If this is true than Jesus is bigger than the Church and we can put aside divisive acrimonious debates about doctrine and dogma and morality (which now really don't matter anymore anyway) and focus on making the Church an arm of UNICEF, on dealing with building "the Kingdom" here and now, the civilization of love of perfect peace, justice, democracy and freedom for everyone. I know this could be fine tuned but it's something that has vexed me for many many years now and I've thought about this stuff  a lot.

For example, here in my diocese there was a Catholic Charities bulletin put out but there was literally nothing in it that gave any indication of it being Catholic other than the word Catholic at the top. It was al about homeless shelters and soup kitchens and the like. The faith had been reduced to social services which is, when push comes to shove, almost logically necessary when you believe that everyone and anyone can be saved no matter what they believe or don't believe. If you are more traditional how do you dare cal into question a soup kitchen or a new shelter, how dare you ask whether these people coming are Catholic or not? They then attack you for being hung up on dogmas and doctrines and religious affiliation when what really matters is the here and now, the practical getting down to business of feeding the hungry and sheltering the poor which, after all, are some of the things Jesus Christ Himself talk about in His frightful parable of the Last Judgement. Of course we should love that the diocese is helping with soup kitchens and shelters and doing the corporal works of mercy but it should also be trying to feed people souls by bringing them to Christ and His Church and the life of grace. The same Jesus who said "feed the hungry" also said "He who believes and his baptized will be saved, he who believes not will be condemned" and " unless a man is born of the water and the Holy Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of Heaven", or the sayings on the Eucharist from John 6.


Reply




Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)