How does a Catholic react to Gay Pride Week?
#21
The point of using the words 'murder' and and 'murderer' is to point out the absurdity of treating public 'gays' and 'sodomy' as tolerable things in Catholicism. Catholicism treats sodomy as seriously as murder. Murder is still an arrestable offence but sodomy may not now be criticised in the UK, unless it's very carefully done, as you may be arrested, if you stray into 'hate speech', as defined by the copper on the scene.

I read a satirical blog post by a Lutheran(?) minister years in which he parodied the 'coming out' of a Lutheran priest to his congregation, by substituting the word 'vampire' for 'gay' e.g. "For a long time now, I have struggled with feelings of being a vampire and wanting to suck blood. I do not think the Lord God would have given me this disposition if he had not wanted me to act upon it ..." and so on.

The congregation ralles around with hugs, some are obviously disgruntled, but the church moves on, with the newly professed memeber of the undead leading it.
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#22
I've told many of my Catholic friends about my longstanding same-sex attractions, along with my desire to remain celibate. Simply "coming out" is not, in essence, an acceptation of the immorality of life. One must admit what one struggles with, among friends.

The sort of coming-out done by the pride parade people, on the other hand, demonstrates that they revel in perversion and open sodomy. I wonder how they can be approached, since their whole life is sex.
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#23
(07-27-2014, 11:39 AM)Layman Wrote: The point of using the words 'murder' and and 'murderer' is to point out the absurdity of treating public 'gays' and 'sodomy' as tolerable things in Catholicism. Catholicism treats sodomy as seriously as murder. Murder is still an arrestable offence but sodomy may not now be criticised in the UK, unless it's very carefully done, as you may be arrested, if you stray into 'hate speech', as defined by the copper on the scene.

I read a satirical blog post by a Lutheran(?) minister years in which he parodied the 'coming out' of a Lutheran priest to his congregation, by substituting the word 'vampire' for 'gay' e.g. "For a long time now, I have struggled with feelings of being a vampire and wanting to suck blood. I do not think the Lord God would have given me this disposition if he had not wanted me to act upon it ..." and so on.

The congregation ralles around with hugs, some are obviously disgruntled, but the church moves on, with the newly professed memeber of the undead leading it.

According to Austenbosten, "sodomy" refers to anal or oral copulation between two people of either sex. Do you agree? Do you think that a man pleasuring his wife orally is sinning? And, if so, is he sinning as seriously as a murderer sins when he murders?

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#24
(07-27-2014, 09:09 AM)austenbosten Wrote: Sodomy:
The act of sexual intercourse involving only either anal or oral copulation.

Sodomy primarily deals with homosexuals, since it is impossible for two homosexuals to engage in proper intercourse.

The logic doesn't follow. Just because two homosexuals can't engage in proper intercourse doesn't mean that sodomy, esp. by your definition of "anal or oral copulation," primarily pertains to them. Heterosexuals have lots and lots of oral and anal sex, especially the former, with the latter becoming more and more popular every day. As to oral sex, here's a line from ABC News: "After four years researching for the documentary, Azam told 'Good Morning America' that oral sex is as common as kissing for teens...'" There are a lot more teenagers than there are homosexuals. Then add in the adults, including married people, who engage in oral and anal sex.

Where does homosexual frottage or mutual masturbation fit into all this, Austen?


BTW, note: Fr. Prümmer's Handbook of Moral Theology, under The Obligations of Marriage: The Lawfulness of the Conjugal Act:

Principle. The conjugal act is lawful and even meritorious as often as it is not opposed to the benefit of offspring and conjugal fidelity. (Sec. 859, 1)

The intrinsic reason for this (I Cor. vii, 3) is that the conjugal act is not only necessary for the propagation of the human race but also for the fostering of married love.  As often as one of these purposes is desired, the conjugal act is lawful, provided that no other ills or inconveniences ensue.  Consequently the partners in marriage are not obliged to exercise sexual intercourse simply for the sake of procreation.  Therefore this act is lawful even if both parties are sterile, also during the time of lactation of pregnancy, on Sundays and on feast days; but it is forbidden to exercise the sexual function by means of onanism or with serious danger to health or at the same time causing scandal to others, etc.

Circumstances of the Conjugal Act.  Not only the conjugal act itself but also touches and looks and all other acts are lawful between the married, provided that there is no proximate danger of pollution and the sole intention is not mere sexual pleasure.  Therefore in ordinary circumstances the confessor should not interrogate married persons about these accompanying acts.

 
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#25
Vox,

I'm really not going to get into this again, we've been down this road one too many times. I'm simply pointing out the definition of "sodomy" according to various dictionary sources...if you have an issue, take it up with the English language, French language, Latin, Merriam-Webster and the University of Oxford.

My "definition" is simply what any literate human person can find by simply picking up a dictionary.
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#26
I gave my take on the only Gay  Pride parade I've watched here:  http://www.fisheaters.com/forums/index.p...sg33973735

That was in 1993.  I don't think much has changed.

But you know, I don't like St. Patrick's Day parades, either, because I detest ethnocentrism and drunkenness.

Ditto on the annual Mummers Day parade on New Years Day in Philly (drunkenness and acting like horses asses, and the near impossibility of finding a restroom).
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#27
(07-27-2014, 03:22 PM)austenbosten Wrote: Vox,

I'm really not going to get into this again, we've been down this road one too many times. I'm simply pointing out the definition of "sodomy" according to various dictionary sources...if you have an issue, take it up with the English language, French language, Latin, Merriam-Webster and the University of Oxford.

My "definition" is simply what any literate human person can find by simply picking up a dictionary.

If the dictionary you picked up said "anal or oral copulation," my point absolutely stands. Nothing changes whatsoever. What I said is still true. Heterosexuals do all of the above. 

So, do  you think a man "going down" on his wife is sinning like a murderer?

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#28
(07-27-2014, 11:39 AM)Layman Wrote: The point of using the words 'murder' and and 'murderer' is to point out the absurdity of treating public 'gays' and 'sodomy' as tolerable things in Catholicism. Catholicism treats sodomy as seriously as murder. Murder is still an arrestable offence but sodomy may not now be criticised in the UK, unless it's very carefully done, as you may be arrested, if you stray into 'hate speech', as defined by the copper on the scene.

Excuse me? "Gays" are "intolerable things" in Catholicism? Not according to the Church's catechism! (I know you said "public gays," as if possibly intimating that someone's being honest about having a disorder might be a problem -- or "not tolerable" --  but that pretty much means "anyone we happen to know is gay.")

Quote: I read a satirical blog post by a Lutheran(?) minister years in which he parodied the 'coming out' of a Lutheran priest to his congregation, by substituting the word 'vampire' for 'gay' e.g. "For a long time now, I have struggled with feelings of being a vampire and wanting to suck blood. I do not think the Lord God would have given me this disposition if he had not wanted me to act upon it ..." and so on.

The congregation ralles around with hugs, some are obviously disgruntled, but the church moves on, with the newly professed memeber of the undead leading it.

Here you're talking about someone coming out and someone's thinking God wants him to act on his feelings as necessarily the same phenomenon. That simply isn't the case. There are many homosexuals on this forum that prove you wrong.

And some people do have psychological disorders involving "vampirism," believing they are vampires, or what have you. And some men are attracted to other men.

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#29
(07-27-2014, 08:10 PM)Vox Clamantis Wrote: If the dictionary you picked up said "anal or oral copulation," my point absolutely stands. Nothing changes whatsoever. What I said is still true. Heterosexuals do all of the above. 

These are the dictionaries I picked up:

Oxford Dictionary Wrote:sodomy
Syllabification: sod·om·y
Pronunciation: /ˈsädəmē

/
noun
Sexual intercourse involving anal or oral copulation.
Origin

Middle English: from medieval Latin sodomia, from late Latin peccatum Sodomiticum 'sin of Sodom' (after Gen. 19:5, which implies that the men of Sodom practiced homosexual rape) (see Sodom).

Merriam-Webster Wrote:sod·omy
noun \ˈsä-də-mē\

: anal sex with someone
Full Definition of SODOMY
:  anal or oral copulation with a member of the same or opposite sex; also :  copulation with an animal
— sod·om·it·ic or sod·om·it·i·cal adjective
See sodomy defined for English-language learners »
Origin of SODOMY
Middle English, from Anglo-French sodomie, from Late Latin Sodoma Sodom; from the homosexual proclivities of the men of the city in Genesis 19:1–11
First Known Use: 13th century

Fr. John Hardons Modern Catholic Dictionary Wrote:SODOMY:
In general, unnatural sexual relations. The term is derived from the biblical city of Sodom on the Dead Sea, destroyed with the city of Gomorrah because of the wickedness of the people (Genesis 13:10). More particularly, sodomy is homosexuality between male persons or between a human being and an animal. (Etym. French sodomie; from Latin Sodoma, Sodom.)

(07-27-2014, 08:10 PM)Vox Clamantis Wrote: So, do  you think a man "going down" on his wife is sinning like a murderer?

Layman made that comment, not me.
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#30
Is the "sins that cry out to heaven for justice" thing dogma? What does Denzinger say on this?
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