10-07-2014, 11:48 AM
(10-07-2014, 10:56 AM)1seeker Wrote: St. Augustine wasn't eastern. St. Hilary wasn't eastern. St. Ambrose who denied communion to the Emperor wasn't eastern. Joking is good, but in the context of Orthodox claims to be the truest church it can be insulting and obnoxious.
Ok but if that's ALL you are saying then we're back to square 1. We haven't moved even a little, because from the outset it was agreed upon that it is not the default view of the West, and is the long-standing view of the East.
The difference arises from your initial claim that prior to 1054 divorce&remarriage WAS more or less the default view in the West, so that when Kasper made his proposal he was returning us to our original belief. You painted divorce&remarriage as nearly an apostolic doctrine, which was preserved in the East, and originally practiced by the 'less-altered' West. Then after 1054 the West took a sharp turn departing in several key places, but Kasper is just returning us to the default opinion of the Original Church. Maybe now you'll see why your words elicited so much ire.
I never said that was the default view in the west, but it was the default position in what numerically constituted the majority of the Catholic Church. Remember even at the time of the schism the eastern patriarchates were more populous than the west. Certainly at the time of Trullo that was more pronounced. And even given that fact you don't find any widespread condemnations or excommunications from any popes. People can read into that anything they want to. Either way apparently enough people find my opinions obnoxious and annoying to pretty much take over the entire thread so I'm gonna bow out and let yall have it. If anyone has any questions I'll be happy to answer as best I can.