The Left's Big Collective Rape Fantasy
#11
(12-26-2014, 12:09 AM)Vox Clamantis Wrote:
(12-25-2014, 11:04 PM)Chestertonian Wrote: i probablu shpouldnt have clicked this

butvox..  you should think
..mqybe for two minutes even..  about how someone who had been raped assaulted would take a lot of what you say

Well, C., you don't know my life, and that's all I'm going to say about that. But my post isn't about victims of rape, or about rape at all; it's  about the pseudo-rape hysteria, the nonsense about our having "a rape culture," the ridiculous definitions of "rape," the abuse of men, false accusations, denying men due process, the destruction of normal relationships between men and women, and so forth.
but you put "rape in quotes to say you do not believe it is legit

there is a rape culture it is inherent in humanitys fallen nature yes feminists misinterprrt this but where there is a sin culture there will always be a rape culture

how do you know whether any of these women are actual rape victims or just bullshitters

you don't

just like you dont know if the homeless man asking for alms is really destitute and won't spend your money on drugs and hookers

we give as an act of mercy regardless because you dont know if you're entertaining angels in disguise

if we dont know the whole story it is charitable to believe them and hear them.

i have had people not believe me before and it feels like shit

i told a social worker once she said " it sounds like you were on a lot of medication ..  she didn't see the .medical reports of physical damage and DNA evidence

people dont want to think about this and imagine people really are that evil.

but joking about survivors just casually talking about their rapes in the same breath as a tv show like it is some fun cool club is just a load of crap ..  whether they are liberal women or trad catholic monarchists


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#12
(12-25-2014, 11:44 PM)Chestertonian Wrote:
(12-22-2014, 09:25 AM)Vox Clamantis Wrote: Mattress Girl refers to the man she alleges attacked her as "my rapist." That first Time article is titled, "My Rapist is Still on Campus." It's 475 words long, and it uses the phrase "my rapist" five times. Does that wording strike you as bizarre as well --- "my rapist"? She uses that phrase in the videos I've seen of her, too. But me, I can't imagine being raped and referring to the person who did that to me as "my" anything. It sounds like such a personal way to speak of a person who'd brutalize and dehumanize you in that sort of way. It makes the rapist sound like a sort of hired hand, as in "my poolboy," or maybe like a "pet" -- "my puppy" -- or a toy, as in "My Little Rapist." No one would refer to "my burglar" when talking about the guy who broke into her house and stole her stereo, or to "my attempted murderer." One'd think that distancing language would be more natural, that referring to "that animal" or "that $^(&^$ piece of &^%^ asshole" would more readily come to the lips.

why do you care?

I care because I care about what is happening to our sons and brothers on college campuses. Spotting hysterics is a good way to help prevent men from having their lives ruined by them.

(12-25-2014, 11:44 PM)Chestertonian Wrote: i am a make survivor and while i do not see this as a legitimate art installayion..wouldlaugh at it as a senior thesis but i can relate to carrying around the weight of the traumatic event i often feel that way too.

good for her for talking openly about what happened to her heaven knows i wouldn't go so public

I don't know about this person's particular case, but at least 50% of reported rapes are false, bogus, straight-out lies:

False Rape Allegations, by Eugene J. Kanin, Ph.D., from the Archives of Sexual Behavior, VoL 23, No. 1, 1994
http://sf-criminaldefense.com/wp-content...ations.pdf

10 Reasons False Rape Accusations are Common
http://www.avoiceformalestudents.com/avf...re-common/


(12-25-2014, 11:44 PM)Chestertonian Wrote: i have used the words "my rapist"before.  wish i never had a reason to.  i think until you have carried that burden you do not know.  it is her business how she is going to refer to the perp.  it is not your call..  you don't live with the reality

How do you know what I live with? I don't live with her reality, but I live with my own. And I also love a lot of people of the male persuasion and don't like the idea of idiot women having them thrown out of college or into prison on a whim, which happens all the time.

Whatever this woman calls "her" rapist is obviously her call, but it's still personalizing language that strikes me as odd.

(12-25-2014, 11:44 PM)Chestertonian Wrote:
(12-22-2014, 09:25 AM)Vox Clamantis Wrote: Anyway, her "rape" and her reaction to it all have led to things like this:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldl-a6GY7Tw


-- and to CarryingTheWeightTogether.com, a website that asks people to sign their names to this pledge --

""I SUPPORT SURVIVORS OF SEXUAL AND DOMESTIC VIOLENCE AND AM HELPING TO #CARRYTHATWEIGHT"
(I think the thinking is that  if you don't make that pledge, you don't "support" survivors,
and if you do sign it, you're in the club, you're kewl!)

-- and to -- get this -- upload pictures of themselves carrying a mattress, pillow, or a written "pledge of solidarity." It also asks them to donate, of course. I have no idea what they'd spend the money on (sheets and pillow cases to match whatever they're wearing, maybe?)

Rape isn't a crime any longer; it's a female bonding experience. It's practically festive! "How's about all us girls getting together, maybe drink some wine, catch an episode of 'Girls', and talk about our rapes?! Sound good?" Check out the faces of the women carrying that mattress in that video or in the pictures.

so i guess laughing about rape and making fun of sexual abuse victims is fine as long as theyre irritating liberals... 

You're missing the point. This has nothing to do with rape; this has to do with hysterical, over-protected females who want to be able to point a finger at a man and make him disappear into the cornfield with no due process whatsoever -- and their actually getting their way.

(12-25-2014, 11:44 PM)Chestertonian Wrote: yeah, i don't like a lot of the sentiment I see and I have my own issues with the greater sexual assault recovery vommunity but at least there is a community

good for the women and menwho seek out healing.

Sure, yes, of course (referring to those actually in need of healing). But carrying around mattresses, signing ridiculous pledges that do absolutely nothing about a non-existent problem, dealing with a hideous and violent and demoralizing crime as the college-age equivalent of yucking it up at a sleep-over, watering down the definition of rape so that any kid with an erection is a "rapist," squandering resources on this nonsense so that real rapists get away -- none of that helps.

(12-25-2014, 11:44 PM)Chestertonian Wrote: what most survivors really are looking for is someone to hear their experience, and process the trauma.  someone who has has been there and can help them know they're not alone

Sure. But there are actual survivors, and then there are girls who are late for curfew so decide to accuse their datse of rape so they have an excuse for getting home late.

(12-25-2014, 11:44 PM)Chestertonian Wrote: women who have been rapedin general have an easier time finding someone to talk to..  as a man it is not so easy i have never met any men in real life that went through rape.

Men suffer from forced sex much more often than women do, and no one gives a damn, apparently (while they simultaneously coddle spoiled college girls who get dumped and, so, accuse their exes of raping them because they have hurty feelings).

(12-25-2014, 11:44 PM)Chestertonian Wrote: the question is..  why are they not going to the church to heal?  why don't they see the church ad a safe space to heal from their trauma... 

Because the same leftists who tell them the all boys are rapists and are out to rape one out of every four of them also lie about Jesus, His Church, History, etc.  These are the kids who mumble stuff about Mithra or "the Inquisition" they know nothing about and feel smug and much more educated than us dumb Christians.

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#13
well vox you could have fooled me because you sound very callous about it all trivializing peoples experiences

rape is never funny regardless of who it happens to

you dobt know the circumstances of each of these people. 
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#14
(12-26-2014, 12:03 AM)Renatus Frater Wrote: Well, to analyze this situation with any seriousness is really above my capacities. I grant that there might be something to this fantasy of domination (though I still think a bit disgusting, as all the fifty shades phenomena was).

I didn't read that book and have no desire to, and haven't read much about it, either, so can't really say much about it, but as to women's fantasies, I don't think it's disgusting; it's how God made women -- to desire the experience of male strength in a pleasurable way. If you ask me, it's His design so that women would naturally look up to and submit to their husbands (and in using that language, I don't mean anything nefarious or abusive; I am referring to simple headship. Headship is made a lot easier for both sexes if the man knows how to "game" a woman.)

(12-26-2014, 12:03 AM)Renatus Frater Wrote: But I still think that, at least, a major component to all this is the change in morals: the complete abandonment of morals in sex and the only principle governing sex being “consent”.
Consent would be well defined if a person were completely free from all external influences and internal things that is not the person, so basically its a concept that assumes already the neutral self (and in this regard this sort of evolution to consent governing sexual relations is a mere consequence of the nihilism of late modernity, of the will defining itself by itself, an absolute free will hovering over a sea of potency). But given that this neutral self does not exist, consent becomes hard to define: when one drinks, when one is driven by some passion, when one is driven by peer pressure, etc., all these things can be seen a posteriori to be outside one, and so one, when all is over, decides—again, after the fact—that there was no consent.
The thing I mentioned about passion still sounds reasonable to me. Why would a girl have intercourse if she didn't desire it? I'm not talking about falling in love and being deceived (though I must note that in some cases of “rape” this is indeed the case! I've read of a woman claiming to be in a “rape relationship” because she was in love with the fella and he wasn't very nice to her, so clearly we are dealing here with a very strange phenomena). But maybe I'm thinking more as a male. But still, that's just one of the infinitude of reasons why “consent” is not well defined.

When it comes to rape, though, one has to think in legal terms, and in that realm, it used to be pretty cut and dry: if she says no and resists, if she is unconscious, if she's underage, it's rape in some form. The sexual abuse of a male wasn't counted as "rape" in that rape required vaginal penetration with a penis, something I see wisdom in given the differences between men and women biologically speaking, in that women risk pregnancy, and rape biologically simulates the marital act. NONE of which is to say that sexual abuse that doesn't involve vaginal penetration isn't equally horrible and devasating, or that the perpetrator doesn't deserve equal punishment (not at all!), but just that the old definition existed for good reason, I think.

Anyway, girls have sex for all sorts of reasons. Sometimes she wants sex (just as much or more than the guy does). Sometimes she wants to keep the guy's attention and thinks that not putting out will cause him to go elsewhere. Sometimes a girl doesn't know how to say "no" (quite seriously. This is especially trouble for girls who were abused as children). Sometimes girls have sex to punish themselves. But when you first wrote about "passion," I took you to be referring to something a lot deeper and more "poetic" than mere lust in that you wrote, "after intercourse comes the sadness that shows that the passion that one had was not for the object but for some construct of one's minds and was something irredeemably ephemeral and unsatisfying." If you're talking plain old lust, while God might judge us more leniently or not depending on all the things you talked about -- the things that make the self "not neutral" -- the law has to be cut and dried about it. Back in the day, no woman in the world would've put on a mini skirt, thigh-high boots, a decolletagey-top, and gone out, by herself, to a bar and gotten sloppy-drunk, had sex with someone, and then accuse him of rape because she'd had a few first. She'd have been too ashamed to have shown up in Court with such a case, and she'd have known that society would've held her responsible for her part in how the evening played out (note that I am talking about consensual sex here, not violent rape). Now, she might regret it the next day, take it to Court and call it rape, and anyone who questioned her behavior would be accused of "victim-blaming" or "slut-shaming." And, in the end, the guy, who was as drunk as she, would be branded a rapist, tossed in prison for a few years, and be forced to identify himself as a sexual offender in any new neighborhood he might move to for the rest of his life.

(12-26-2014, 12:03 AM)Renatus Frater Wrote: Also, let's not forget that ethics is not something outside of us, as a set of rules that does not affect our persons, our groups and the society (this also is a liberal—in the classical sense—myth). In fact morals do shape how people think and act and the society in general, I mean, just consider what happened in the fall of the old Thomistic-Aristotelian (or, to put in more annoyingly general terms, the classical) ethics and the rise of the modern ethics that is basically voluntarism: persons changed drastically. Ethics is much more than a system, and is something that deforms (or forms) minds.

Anyway, I don't think I can defend my case any further (I mean, its the most reasonable explanation to me, but I grant it might not be the whole story), and talking about this is kinda icky to me, so I'll just let this be.

Roger that Sticking tongue out at you
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#15
mo it is not normal or natural to fantasize about being raped

a women wanting to be overcome by a mans strength..  that is not rape..  rape is overcoming someone with weakness... weakness against controlling your appetite weakness in the battle for self mastery...

who fantasizes about being used about being objectified made into an object just a receptacle for body fluids? 

nothing sexy about that
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#16
(12-26-2014, 12:30 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: but you put "rape in quotes to say you do not believe it is legit

Not sure what you're thinking I'm thinking here, C. I mean, surely you don't think that I think there's no such thing as legitimate rape...  If so, I assure you, I know that rape exists.

(12-26-2014, 12:30 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: there is a rape culture it is inherent in humanitys fallen nature yes feminists misinterprrt this but where there is a sin culture there will always be a rape culture

I don't buy the phrase. We have a fallen nature, but we don't live in "a rape culture." Maybe the German women did when the Soviets came around during WWII, and I think it can definitely be said that there's a rape culture in men's prisons, but in the USofA, in general, no. The idea that we do live in "a rape culture" is just another radical feminist way of shaming men and getting them to shut up and do as they're told. I am tired of seeing men abused. I really am.

(12-26-2014, 12:30 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: how do you know whether any of these women are actual rape victims or just bullsh**ters

you don't

just like you dont know if the homeless man asking for alms is really destitute and won't spend your money on drugs and hookers

we give as an act of mercy regardless because you dont know if you're entertaining angels in disguise

if we dont know the whole story it is charitable to believe them and hear them.

i have had people not believe me before and it feels like sh**

Like I said, I don't know much about mattress girl's story. I do know she's walking around with a mattress on her back, which used to be a joke way of referring to a prostitute, so not a slick move, if you ask me.  But I have read the stories from MANY, MANY of these alleged "rape victims," and from even more of the men who've been falsely accused.  And soooooooo many of them are completely ridiculous examples of female regret, women not wanting to take responsibility for their actions, out-and-out lies, revenge, women getting busted by their boyfriends for having an affair, and so forth. Maybe you haven't searched this sort of thing out, but I've read a whole lot about what's going on out there, especially on campuses, and it's BAD for men. Very bad. You have a son, C. You really do need to be extremely concerned with what's going on with this stuff.

(12-26-2014, 12:30 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: i told a social worker once she said " it sounds like you were on a lot of medication ..  she didn't see the .medical reports of physical damage and DNA evidence

Hmmm.. I'm not sure what you're saying here.. Are you saying that she was accusing you of having dreamed it up in some opioid-induced delirium or something? If so, that sucks. And it's obvious to me that if someone claims to have been raped or abused, you give that person the benefit of the doubt and act helpful. But that is how to deal with individuals. What I am talking about is a definite trend, a phenomenon, a situation in which we are told the untruth that "1 in 4 girls" will be raped during their 4 years of college life. That's a lie. And that lie is pretty much saying that a pretty large percentage of our boys are rapists. That's not just a lie; that's defamation, slander, libel, and such a hideously nasty thing to say about our sons and brothers that it pisses me OFF.

(12-26-2014, 12:30 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: people dont want to think about this and imagine people really are that evil.

I think people know people like that exist. They just don't want to think of such a person being in their space, their school, their hospital, etc.

(12-26-2014, 12:30 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: but joking about survivors just casually talking about their rapes in the same breath as a tv show like it is some fun cool club is just a load of crap ..  whether they are liberal women or trad catholic monarchists

I'm not joking about survivors. That's precisely the point. It's those silly girls bonding over their shared rape fantasies (and that is exactly what they're doing) that are turning the concept of rape into a social joke. They are making it TONS more difficult for TRUE survivors to be believed and helped. They are squandering police resources, making it more difficult to focus on the real rapists. They are the fools crying "wolf!" over and over again, with their bogus stories of "rape" that explode in the media after a few weeks, thereby making anyone who talks about rape look like a liar. It is THOSE WOMEN who are hurting rape victims. They need to be stopped. They need to grow up and take responsibility for their lives and actions, to treat men like human beings, to stop with their defense mechanisms that make them see men as out to get them, and themselves as innocent victims. What they are doing is evil.

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#17
(12-26-2014, 12:56 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: well vox you could have fooled me because you sound very callous about it all trivializing peoples experiences

rape is never funny regardless of who it happens to

you dobt know the circumstances of each of these people.

I don't need to know the circumstances of every rape victim or every alleged rape victim to know that there is a social phenomenon going on right now in which we are lied to about 1 in 4 girls being raped during their 4 years at college. We are lied to and told that girls don't lie about rape, that they never falsely accuse men of rape (the reality is that rape actually IS an underreported crime, ironically enough. The REAL victims quite often don't report -- while false accusations make up at least 50% of what is reported). We have laws in California now that require male students to get an enthusiastic and affirmative yes for each and every step of a sexual encounter lest he be accused of rape (apparently, he should also somehow have Court-worthy evidence for each of these yeses at each step, otherwise it's all just "he said, she said" -- and "she" always wins those arguments in Court). We've had rape story after rape story go really big in the media and then fall apart, only to get shoved down the memory hole. We have women making false accusations against men, dragging their names through the mud in newspapers, having them thrown in jail, and when they are found out or finally recant their stories, they get off scot-free -- while the man's name is forever tarnished. We have had SO many boys thrown out of college because of the mere accusation from a girl -- with absolutely ZERO due process.

Seriously, read this thread:  http://www.fisheaters.com/forums/index.p...sg33991428

And check out this site -- Community of the Wrongly Accused:  http://www.cotwa.info/  Bookmark it and go through the archives. Check in on it once a week or so. Truly, C., it is awful out there for men.

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#18
(12-26-2014, 01:33 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: mo it is not normal or natural to fantasize about being raped

a women wanting to be overcome by a mans strength..  that is not rape.. 

Overcome while protesting, yes. That's rape.  Most women don't fantasize about extreme violence. I doubt many dream about getting stabbed or shot or anything. But physically mastered? While protesting? That's rape, and that's a very common fantasy among women.

(12-26-2014, 01:33 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: rape is overcoming someone with weakness... weakness against controlling your appetite weakness in the battle for self mastery...

Yes, and in the rape fantasy, the women is the one who is weaker, who has weakness relative to the man she is fantasizing about.

(12-26-2014, 01:33 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: who fantasizes about being used about being objectified made into an object just a receptacle for body fluids? 

Many women do:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19085605

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/all-...-they-mean
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#19
yes i have a son but i also have a wife who is a survivor...  who was never believed when she tried talking about it as a child who will never report what happened to her

the process of reporting a rape is retraumatixing as well as the legal process after the report is made

i would never have gone through it it id were up to me

i agree that there are bullshitters out there and stories that sign ddubious .. i have also encountered men with dubious stories that sound like a gay one night stand that they regret

i wonder how many good Catholic men who are devoted to chastity get falsely sccusef of rape...  theres a problem with the college hookup culture for both men and wmen yes there are men out there who will take advantage of drunk woman with low self esteem and there are women who will warp the legal system to destroy you...  all the better reason to skip the hookup party culture..  hopefully my son will be tge sort of man who saves sex for msrriage






(12-26-2014, 02:58 AM)Vox Clamantis Wrote:
(12-26-2014, 01:33 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: mo it is not normal or natural to fantasize about being raped

a women wanting to be overcome by a mans strength..  that is not rape.. 

Overcome while protesting, yes. That's rape.  Most women don't fantasize about extreme violence. I doubt many dream about getting stabbed or shot or anything. But physically mastered? While protesting? That's rape, and that's a very common fantasy among women.

(12-26-2014, 01:33 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: rape is overcoming someone with weakness... weakness against controlling your appetite weakness in the battle for self mastery...

Yes, and in the rape fantasy, the women is the one who is weaker, who has weakness relative to the man she is fantasizing about.

(12-26-2014, 01:33 AM)Chestertonian Wrote: who fantasizes about being used about being objectified made into an object just a receptacle for body fluids? 

Many women do:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19085605

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/all-...-they-mean
just because it is commn does not mean it is healthy or normal

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#20
I wonder if it's common for men to fantasize about raping women? And would it be terribly offensive of me to even suggest such a thing?

I am really disappointed (the understatement of the year) so see the direction this site has gone regarding women and sexual issues in general. I would have deleted myself if I had the power, but since I don't... you can delete me or not. This will be my last post.
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