Married gay man denied communion at mother's funeral
#31
(07-28-2015, 01:27 PM)formerbuddhist Wrote: Perhaps this wouldn't be such a huge deal if less people were receiving Communion regularly. Up until fairly recently it was not that common in either East or West for everyone present at every Liturgy to recieve Communion. Maybe I'm just too Russian in my sensibilities but I rather like the idea of infrequent Communion and serious preparation beforehand. If it weren't so common for people to recieve people wouldn't feel left out in the first place.

Frequent Communion has led to everything from the abuse of having laity in the sanctuary,an entitlement mentality amongst congregants and the trivialization and banalization of the Eucharist. I know not all see things the way I do in this matter, but just my two cents. Pius X opened up a Pandora's box that he could not have foreseen in his own more conservative time. Perhaps it's time to revisit frequent Communion.

I don't believe (and cannot prove) that frequent communion is to blame for all of what you mention.  Is it not the case that many Church Fathers recommend it?  Perhaps the problem is more one of very poor catechesis and very poor understanding of what the Sacraments are and do.

Me, I like being able to receive Holy Communion frequently, as I believe it helps keep me "on the straight and narrow" path.  Me being me, I believe without it, I'd really be doomed. :O
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#32
(07-28-2015, 10:14 AM)Melkite Wrote:
(07-28-2015, 10:06 AM)Papist Wrote:
(07-28-2015, 10:04 AM)Melkite Wrote:
(07-28-2015, 03:42 AM)Cyriacus Wrote: If a "married" (in the eyes of the state) homosexual couple decides they would like to live chastely and become reconciled with the Church, would they be required to live separately and go through a legal divorce? Or could they remain extremely close friends with a co-living arrangement, and even remain legally married?

So, the boyfriend I mentioned a few years ago that caused many of the fake Catholics, who later fled over to WCF, to rip their garments and put on sackcloth and ash in true Pharisaic pomp, he and I are still together, living in the same apartment.  But we have not done anything sexual with each other in over a year, and don't sleep in the same room.  When I recently returned to the Church, the priest I confessed to, who is extremely traditional, said he has no problem with us living together if sexual activity is unlikely to occur.  So, I assume that people would be allowed to live together as long as they are trying to remain chaste and going to confession immediately if they slip up.  If they are legally married, I imagine the priest would want to know if they believed it constituted an actual marriage or if they recognized that it was only a binding legal contract that had no significance as far as the Church is concerned.
Did the priest approve this as a permanent living situation or as more of a transitional one?

There wasn't really a definition on that.  At first he asked me if it was possible for me to move or if I was stuck in the living situation.  This was before I told him that we had not been sexually active for over a year.  Then he told me he was ok with us living together if we are able to refrain from having sex.  He did not tell me I needed to move out as soon as I am able to.

There are occasions where it might be necessary for those who were formerly sexually active together to continue to live together. For example, they may not be able to afford to love separately. One may depend on the other for physical help if they are elderly or disabled. They may even be raising a child together. In situations such as this, they need to come up with concrete ways to avoid near occasions of sin. They also need to hold themselves accountable to someone else, such as a confessor or spiritual director.  If the temptation is too great, or if one person decides he doesn't want to live chastely anymore, then the person seeking to live according to the Church's teachings must leave, whatever the cost may be.
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#33
(07-28-2015, 10:10 AM)Melkite Wrote: Maybe those parishes should be broken up into smaller parishes?  The Orthodox priest definitely has a more paternal relationship with his parishioners than many Catholic priests.  For these Catholic mega churches, it seems the pastors role is often limited to a bureaucratic one.

There aren't enough priests to do that. If there were, there would be more priests in each parish who could attend to individual needs better. That being said, I have found that when I truly need a priest to be there for me, he's there. If the priest is a good priest, he will help those who come to him in need.
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#34
I don't see the problem as caused by frequent reception of Holy Communion.  If one is properly prepared to received Holy Communion, then one should receive.  Part of the problem is that people either don't know what they are to do to properly prepare or they fail to do it.

The real problem is that reception of Holy Communion has become politicized as people attempt to use reception of Our Lord to prove a point about their lifestyle.  In reality, we should be receiving Our Lord in Holy Communion as the medicine to help us turn from our lifestyle to His. 

I wonder if part of this isn't somehow caused by the mentality that one receives Communion as a reward for "being good" instead of with fear and contrition.  If one sees reception of Communion as a reward for "being good," then it makes sense to publicly receive to prove a point that whatever your bugaboo sin is doesn't make you any "less good" than anyone else.

I don't know if that makes sense to anyone but me, but there you go...
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#35
(07-28-2015, 10:36 AM)Papist Wrote:
(07-28-2015, 10:10 AM)Melkite Wrote: Maybe those parishes should be broken up into smaller parishes?  The Orthodox priest definitely has a more paternal relationship with his parishioners than many Catholic priests.  For these Catholic mega churches, it seems the pastors role is often limited to a bureaucratic one.
Do you think we have enough priests to staff all of those smaller parishes?

The priest shortage must be significantly more critical in the Latin church.
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#36
(07-28-2015, 05:42 PM)Credidi Propter Wrote:
(07-28-2015, 10:10 AM)Melkite Wrote: Maybe those parishes should be broken up into smaller parishes?  The Orthodox priest definitely has a more paternal relationship with his parishioners than many Catholic priests.  For these Catholic mega churches, it seems the pastors role is often limited to a bureaucratic one.

There aren't enough priests to do that. If there were, there would be more priests in each parish who could attend to individual needs better. That being said, I have found that when I truly need a priest to be there for me, he's there. If the priest is a good priest, he will help those who come to him in need.

I also forgot when I first wrote this that confession is done separate from the main part of the church in the West.  A priest may not need to remember everyone that has gone to confession in the East...anyone who was in the church at the time the person went to confession knows and watched them doing it.
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#37
Quote:He said he still believes in the Catholic faith but isn’t sure of his “place” in the church.

Then either he wasn't well catechized or he has rejected the Catholic faith and is just making a show.

As a male experiencing same-sex attractions, I can say that it's really very clear and easy, to me: my place in the Church is the same place as every other human person in the Church: a stone; a plain, unassuming, but essential stone in the masonry of the Temple of God.

St. Peter:

[...] coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men -- but is choice and precious in the sight of God -- you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.


or, St. Paul:

[...] you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints, and are of God's household, having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the corner stone, in whom the whole building, being fitted together, is growing into a holy temple in the Lord, in whom you also are being built together into a dwelling of God in the Spirit.

Our divine adoption into Christ confers son-ship on us, via Baptism and the sacraments... theosis pending...

People don't realize how simple all this really is. We are to be in relationship with others, serving them and seeing only "the Other" as the center of our service, our love, our sacrifice. Whether this Other is God or neighbour, we serve them and live for them. In that way, the Church is built.

This man does not know what he does. The archbishop and canon lawyer and all these poor clergy don't know what they do. What a mess we're in. I'm sure Christ is making intercession for them very strongly at this moment. What else can He do for His own poor little ones?

Why does everything have to become an exercise in political abstraction? "Oh, those Catholic priests! How bigoted!" "Oh, those sodomites! How disgusting!". We're dealing with utterly broken human beings here, on all sides. Let's pray for everyone -- every last one of them!
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#38
Whatev. Pretty much sick of this "non-straights are maligned by society" talk that's clearly being pushed my the media. I just shrug my shoulders and go on with my day. Tell me when beatings, lynchings and being fired for their sexuality happens and then I'll muster up sympathy.
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#39
As far as I know frequent daily Communion at the liturgy is something fairly recent in both East and West. In the early Church non Christians weren't even allowed to stay for the consecration, so it's easy to assume that the ones that did get to stay were diehards and probably properly disposed.

Another thing is that, in the new Mass the focus is an assembly gathered around the table of the Lord,a banquet of sorts. The songs that perfectly encapsulate this new attitude is All are Welcome and Table of Plenty. If the Liturgy is a communal feast around a table for all and sundry like our Lord dining with prostitutes and publicans, than there's no reason any self professed Christian should ever be barred from approaching the Table.  I think this is an argument used by some.

Perhaps it's not frequency of Communion that's the main problem ( although I still think it ought to be curbed until people are better catechized) but faulty Catechesis and the new theological focus of the Mass as a gathering around a table.
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#40
(07-29-2015, 06:18 PM)formerbuddhist Wrote: Perhaps it's not frequency of Communion that's the main problem (although I still think it ought to be curbed until people are better catechized) but faulty Catechesis and the new theological focus of the Mass as a gathering around a table.

Exactly. The Mass is primarily a sacrifice. People point to the fact that the Last Supper was a communal meal. They seem to forget that the Last Supper wasn't just any meal. It was the Passover. This wasn't just some casual meal. This was a very important ritual- their most important ritual.  By focusing on the Mass as a "gathering around a table," people deny the supernatural reality of it.

Ecce Panis Angelorum,
Factus cibus viatorum
Vere panis filiorum,
Non mittendus canibus.
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