lay devotions in latin>
#11
(09-28-2015, 03:04 PM)GangGreen Wrote: Public prayer should always be in Latin, IMO. I know others may think differently. I often find myself responding to the NO Mass in Latin when I go. I don't do so loudly Tolkien style, but it just feels better to me.

LOL I also do this. Mainly because the translations literally have nothing to do with the Latin (for instance, et cum spiritu tuo became, in Portuguese, he is among us.. wt?), and I'm genuinely confused when I try to respond some longer responses in the vernacular (like the suscipiat dominus--I also stumble when I try to sing the Salve Regina in the vernacular).

My grandparents and great-grandparents prayed the rosary in the vernacular. I pray my vocal prayers in Latin because I'm already used to, while mental prayer I do in the vernacular.
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#12
(09-28-2015, 01:01 PM)Oldavid Wrote: Even as a 7 or 8 year old boy serving at Mass or Benediction I could recite all the prayers in Latin and I knew what they meant even if I could not translate them word-for-word into the vernacular.
Reminds me of a joke. A liberal 'member of the liturgical committee' was remonstrating a conservative Priest for the traditional language that he used in the Mass. He called over an altar boy and said, 'I'll bet you don't know what "Kyrie eleison" means. The boy answered, 'I sure do. It means 'Domine misere'!
Quote:Credo in Unum Deum will never be "we believe in a god"

Well in 35 years as a Catholic I've never seen it translated that way.
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#13
Right; devotional prayer is in the vernacular. No point in doing it in Latin; it would be showing off. I love Latin; it has its place liturgically, but still. (And I'd be fine with the traditional Mass in the vernacular as an option.)

Reminds me: I think a reason the Our Father is still "thy" is the only English prayers that English-speaking Catholics care about are the ones they've always prayed in the vernacular, those of the Rosary and grace before meals. Since that includes the Our Father, even the most liberal priest keeps it "thy" at Mass.
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#14
(09-29-2015, 06:29 AM)youngfogey Wrote: Right; devotional prayer is in the vernacular. No point in doing it in Latin; it would be showing off. I love Latin; it has its place liturgically, but still. (And I'd be fine with the traditional Mass in the vernacular as an option.)

Reminds me: I think a reason the Our Father is still "thy" is the only English prayers that English-speaking Catholics care about are the ones they've always prayed in the vernacular, those of the Rosary and grace before meals. Since that includes the Our Father, even the most liberal priest keeps it "thy" at Mass.

Showing off to... yourself  ???
Devotions don't have a fixed language buddy, so leave Latin lovers alone.
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#15
(09-29-2015, 10:01 AM)Renatus Frater Wrote: Showing off to... yourself  ???

Yes. In other words, vainglory. Unfortunately, much of our religious life involves reassuring ourselves or impressing ourselves.
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#16
(09-29-2015, 11:05 AM)Clare Brigid Wrote:
(09-29-2015, 10:01 AM)Renatus Frater Wrote: Showing off to... yourself  ???

Yes. In other words, vainglory. Unfortunately, much of our religious life involves reassuring ourselves or impressing ourselves.

I think you guys are jumping to a lot of dangerous conclusions here.

Also, check out what this person says, especially the first paragraph.
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#17
Renatus, my frater, we are saying that vainglory is a substantial risk.

I think it's important for trads to hear about spiritual sins on a frequent basis.  We need to caution each other, without pronouncing condemnations.
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#18
(09-29-2015, 11:19 AM)Clare Brigid Wrote: I think it's important for trads to hear about spiritual sins on a frequent basis.  We need to caution each other, without pronouncing condemnations.
Is "reproving the sinner" possible without "pronouncing condemnations"?
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#19
(09-29-2015, 06:29 AM)youngfogey Wrote: Right; devotional prayer is in the vernacular. No point in doing it in Latin; it would be showing off. I love Latin; it has its place liturgically, but still. (And I'd be fine with the traditional Mass in the vernacular as an option.)

Reminds me: I think a reason the Our Father is still "thy" is the only English prayers that English-speaking Catholics care about are the ones they've always prayed in the vernacular, those of the Rosary and grace before meals. Since that includes the Our Father, even the most liberal priest keeps it "thy" at Mass.
I would love to see the TML in venacular, rather than have the NO be the regularly celebrated liturgy.
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#20
(09-29-2015, 01:13 PM)Oldavid Wrote: Is "reproving the sinner" possible without "pronouncing condemnations"?

Yes, but the conditions for admonishing the sinner are fairly restricted.  Here is a good Catholic encyclopedia article on these conditions:  http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/04394a.htm
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