Do You Think Masturbation is a Mortal Sin?
#61
+PAX DOMINUS VOBISCUM+

My Catholic friend has come out of his pornography addiction since the last 2 years but his habit of masturbation still persists...

He's currently undergoing treatment but since his porn addiction was deep rooted, it would take some more time for him to let go of his addiction to masturbate...

Would he still be committing a mortal sin or a grave sin or both, given the above case...?

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#62
(01-15-2018, 08:22 AM)AndreasIosephus Wrote: +PAX DOMINUS VOBISCUM+

My Catholic friend has come out of his pornography addiction since the last 2 years but his habit of masturbation still persists...

He's currently undergoing treatment but since his porn addiction was deep rooted, it would take some more time for him to let go of his addiction to masturbate...

Would he still be committing a mortal sin or a grave sin or both, given the above case...?

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It really is difficult to say on the mortal, but grave an absolute yes.  Masturbation and all sexual immorality is grave and nothing changes that.  One who masturbates in their sleep would still be committing a grave sin, but since there's no culpability there would be no sin, or at worst venial.

It would appear your friend's culpability is lessened due to the terrible addiction to pornography that fueled his nasty habit.  If your friend has any fear, I would say that he needs to not worry so much about committing the sin, but focusing on being free of it.  Speaking from personal experience, he will fall many many times, but God will pick him up as long as he frequents Confession.  Your friend should see it as I saw it, a marathon against the Devil and one's self.  You will stumble, you will fall, but never give up trying, never give up the dream, never give up the goal of being free of that perfidy and rely heavily on God, the Sacraments (most especially Confession), and the sacramentals (the Rosary being a devastatingly powerful weapon against temptation.)
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#63
(01-15-2018, 10:02 AM)austenbosten Wrote:
(01-15-2018, 08:22 AM)AndreasIosephus Wrote: +PAX DOMINUS VOBISCUM+

My Catholic friend has come out of his pornography addiction since the last 2 years but his habit of masturbation still persists...

He's currently undergoing treatment but since his porn addiction was deep rooted, it would take some more time for him to let go of his addiction to masturbate...

Would he still be committing a mortal sin or a grave sin or both, given the above case...?

Sent from my SM-G610F using Tapatalk

It really is difficult to say on the mortal, but grave an absolute yes.  Masturbation and all sexual immorality is grave and nothing changes that.  One who masturbates in their sleep would still be committing a grave sin, but since there's no culpability there would be no sin, or at worst venial.

It would appear your friend's culpability is lessened due to the terrible addiction to pornography that fueled his nasty habit.  If your friend has any fear, I would say that he needs to not worry so much about committing the sin, but focusing on being free of it.  Speaking from personal experience, he will fall many many times, but God will pick him up as long as he frequents Confession.  Your friend should see it as I saw it, a marathon against the Devil and one's self.  You will stumble, you will fall, but never give up trying, never give up the dream, never give up the goal of being free of that perfidy and rely heavily on God, the Sacraments (most especially Confession), and the sacramentals (the Rosary being a devastatingly powerful weapon against temptation.)

Thanks, @austenbosten...! 

However, could anyone clarify about the mortal sin aspect w.r.t. the above case...?
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#64
(01-15-2018, 01:23 PM)AndreasIosephus Wrote: Thanks, @austenbosten...! 

However, could anyone clarify about the mortal sin aspect w.r.t. the above case...?

I don't think any honest person could tell you that, since there's not enough information. It's really best left up to the individual and their confessor to make that determination. Though hypothetically if one struggles with an addiction it could be a venial sin, despite it being grave.
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#65
Hi there. Just discovered this thread. Might, you sure opened a big can of worms! But I can relate because I have asked similar questions on this forum. The topic of masturbation is probably one of the most highly contested items of Church teaching because it is so hard to follow, because everyone does it, and because it's so hard for men not to do it simply because of how they are made and how their sexual organs work. I am female, but I have struggled with masturbation since I was a child and still fight it every day (as the good folks on this forum know very well).


If you don't mind answering a hypothetical ... If you were new to the faith and didn’t know the Church taught this. And you were a validly married Catholic man and your wife for psychological reasons unable to be intimidate with you. And you masturbated to loving thoughts of her.

First of all, unless your wife is ill or you have grave reasons to avoid having children, you should be having sex with her and not need to masturbate to relieve the tension. If she won't have sex with you for psychological reasons, you both need to go to counseling. A marriage without healthy and frequent sex is a dead marriage.

If you didn't know that masturbation is a mortal sin until now, you are excused due to your ignorance and did not commit a mortal sin. But now that you know, you will be held accountable and you should not receive Holy Communion if you have not confessed this sin in confession first. 

"Masturbating to loving thoughts of her" is still a sin because you are still using your wife's body without her consent. You are imagining her doing things to you and with you that she has no control over. You are creating a fantasy of your wife in your mind that is not reality and will damage your expectations of sex with her in the future. In your mind, while you masturbate to her mental image, your wife is the perfect partner and does exactly what you want. Real sex is not like that. When you masturbate to mental images of your wife, even though she is your wife, you are still treating her like an object that brings you pleasure without any effort or sacrifice on your part. You are basically using your wife as your own personal porn star to pull up in your mind and use whenever you feel like it. There is nothing loving about that, and if you related your fantasies in detail to your wife, I wonder how she would feel about it.

Now, I am not saying that you are completely at fault here. Does your wife know that you masturbate to relieve the tension of not having sex with her? If she is willingly and purposely denying you sex for no good reason, she is also to blame, but you are still responsible for your actions. Your wife cannot force you to masturbate any more than you can force her to have sex with you. Again, please go to counseling. You are validly married--you should be having sex with your wife unless there are grave circumstances in the way.

 I’m sorry for not just blindly excepting this teaching, if it even is the Church’s teaching. I can’t seem to find a clear explanation for it. I just know that something is obviously not right with it. Where did it originate from? it’s not explicitly stated in the reveled Word, like the commandment not to divorce your wife. Did a Pope degreed it? Maybe a council define it? I just don’t know.

There are many laws of God and concepts of our faith that are not explicitly outlined in the Bible/God's written word. Purgatory is not explicitly defined, and the word "Trinity" does not appear either. But we can infer that masturbation is a selfish and sinful act and a misuse of our God-given sexuality from Jesus's teachings on adultery and lust. Read Matthew 5:27. Jesus says that if you even look at a woman with lust, you have already committed adultery with her in your heart. He warns against the sins of the eyes (impure glances and fantasies) and then sins of the hand. What sinful sexual acts do you commit with your hands? Masturbation, obviously. It is interesting indeed for Jesus to mention the obvious sins of the eyes and then specifically the hand (He could have said "loins" or whatever the Biblical equivalent of genitals would be). But the fact that He mentions the hand when referring to sexual sin is pretty specific. But even if this doesn't assure you, the very concept of what masturbation is should be enough to show you that it is contrary to God's plan for sexuality.

Because really, what is masturbation? It is a deliberate way to get the pleasure from sex without being open to life or giving yourself to another person. Our culture has succeeded very well in separating the sacrificial, procreative aspect of sex from the pleasurable aspect, and look what has happened. So much abuse, so many murdered unwanted unborn children, so many selfish people hooking up and using each other for a quick fling. When you masturbate, you, a baptized Catholic, are debasing and lowering yourself to the same level as the rest of the sick, unenlightened world. You are literally violating yourself. Masturbation used to be referred to as "self abuse" for a good reason. You are deliberately misusing your sexual organs, just how homosexual men misuse their sexual organs in a different manner.


I will continue to question it like I have until someone can give me a reasonable answer. I’m sorry. I just can’t blindly except anymore what the Church tells me, especially after the un-Catholic things this Bishop of Rome has said and the disastrous synod on the family that just took place. I know G-d gave me my reason and intellect for a purpose and I am bound and determined to use it.  I will no longer blindly believe what this obviously sickend institutional church tells me.

I am glad you are asking questions and not just blindly accepting things. I understand and agree with you that you need to know "why" in your head before you believe in your heart. But I would caution you against seeking advice in a forum like this. None of us are trained theologians or priests. we all have our different opinions and experiences. This is a difficult subject and the answers you get here will only conflict and confuse you. So please consider doing these three things:

1. See a counselor so your wife will have sex with you again, as she should be doing unless there is a grave reason.

2. Seek out a good priest, make an appointment with him, and ask him all the questions you have asked us here.

3. Pray that God will open your heart to His Truth. Ask the Holy Spirit to enlighten you to the teachings of the Church.

Good luck and God bless you.
I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn’t work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness.

If God is watching us, the least we can do is be entertaining.

Knowledge is power, and power corrupts. So study hard and be evil.






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#66
(01-29-2018, 02:40 PM)SacraCor714 Wrote: Hi there. Just discovered this thread. Might, you sure opened a big can of worms! But I can relate because I have asked similar questions on this forum. The topic of masturbation is probably one of the most highly contested items of Church teaching because it is so hard to follow, because everyone does it, and because it's so hard for men not to do it simply because of how they are made and how their sexual organs work. I am female, but I have struggled with masturbation since I was a child and still fight it every day (as the good folks on this forum know very well).

And just how exactly did you come to that rationalization? The truth of the matter here is not really a male / female issue nor does it have anything to do with how our sexual organs work. When a person has an orgasm they get a massive high from the neurochemicals in their brain (i.e. oxytocin, dopamine, etc). Both men and women have those chemicals in their brain which is why neuroscientists often compare the feelings of love to that which a crack addict experiences on a high. At the end of the day these habits are more a function of our brains / socialization than our sex organs. That is true for men or women. Women are just more inhibited when it comes to sex because getting pregnant is a very real outcome that every woman is conditioned from the day they start having periods to avoid. Sprinkling in a little feminist hate for men that they get from their mothers, sisters, and society I really wonder if its possible for women to be attracted to men at all.....anyway subject for another thread.

(01-29-2018, 02:40 PM)SacraCor714 Wrote: First of all, unless your wife is ill or you have grave reasons to avoid having children, you should be having sex with her and not need to masturbate to relieve the tension. If she won't have sex with you for psychological reasons, you both need to go to counseling. A marriage without healthy and frequent sex is a dead marriage.

Or maybe we should encourage him to forget about his wife and go find some other constructive outlet for his creative energy. I think a lot of this sexual energy comes from putting a cork on men's creative energy. Men are builders. Men are constructors. Men are explorers. Most men have long lost our roots in this these days. If it wasn't for my programming projects I would probably be going ape.

(01-29-2018, 02:40 PM)SacraCor714 Wrote: "Masturbating to loving thoughts of her" is still a sin because you are still using your wife's body without her consent.

No, he is not. That would be rape and just because you fantasize about someone it does not mean you should be charged with a crime. He is rendering her as a tool though as you indicated.

(01-29-2018, 02:40 PM)SacraCor714 Wrote: You are imagining her doing things to you and with you that she has no control over. You are creating a fantasy of your wife in your mind that is not reality and will damage your expectations of sex with her in the future. In your mind, while you masturbate to her mental image, your wife is the perfect partner and does exactly what you want. Real sex is not like that. When you masturbate to mental images of your wife, even though she is your wife, you are still treating her like an object that brings you pleasure without any effort or sacrifice on your part. You are basically using your wife as your own personal porn star to pull up in your mind and use whenever you feel like it. There is nothing loving about that, and if you related your fantasies in detail to your wife, I wonder how she would feel about it.

Agreed. Real sex just shows you what a sham all the hubbub about sex really is. Real sex is where a woman uses her the power of her body to coax a man into making a complete fool out of himself through the sacrifice of his dignity so she can dangle it over him at a later date. The only one who truly holds the cards is the one who says no. That's why the OP feels like a pressurized bottle and the wife is probably enjoying life otherwise.

(01-29-2018, 02:40 PM)SacraCor714 Wrote: Because really, what is masturbation? It is a deliberate way to get the pleasure from sex without being open to life or giving yourself to another person. Our culture has succeeded very well in separating the sacrificial, procreative aspect of sex from the pleasurable aspect, and look what has happened. So much abuse, so many murdered unwanted unborn children, so many selfish people hooking up and using each other for a quick fling. When you masturbate, you, a baptized Catholic, are debasing and lowering yourself to the same level as the rest of the sick, unenlightened world. You are literally violating yourself. Masturbation used to be referred to as "self abuse" for a good reason. You are deliberately misusing your sexual organs, just how homosexual men misuse their sexual organs in a different manner.

Good point!
Local anti-feminist.....if you think women deserve special treatment without any accountability for their actions expect to hear from me!
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