Archdiocese of Chicago wants to demolish the Shrine of Christ the King
#11
Of course it's also a matter of where they are moved. I'm sure they'll get the normal traditionalist treatment where they're sent to some cruddy, shady, run down neighborhood.
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#12
Woodlawn is already pretty dicey neighborhood, honestly, but the Shrine of Christ the King is fairly close to Hyde Park and the University of Chicago, which mitigates that somewhat. I'm not sure where else the Institute could move and still retain a presence in Chicago's South Side. The further it goes south or west it has to move, the more intimidating (and often quite dangerous) it becomes.
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#13
(01-13-2016, 03:39 AM)Poche Wrote: I think that your criticism of the archdiocese is unfair. There was a fire. The building is severely damaged. The archdiocese is not putting the community out. They may relocate them to another location. If they throw a bomb and blow up the church, they don't stop saying mass. They move to another location.   

I agree. It's  not like they're taking a perfectly sound building and tearing it down. They are wanting to tear down a century-old building that has suffered a fire. If it was a modern building, maybe it could be fixed because of modern redundancies designed into the structure, but repairing an old building even without a fire is often cost-prohibitive.

(01-13-2016, 09:09 AM)GangGreen Wrote: Of course it's also a matter of where they are moved. I'm sure they'll get the normal traditionalist treatment where they're sent to some cruddy, shady, run down neighborhood.

That's very possible.

But I was thinking about that last night - maybe the reason why the traditionalists often get these types of parishes is because they're sitting empty. I'm thinking about the new parishes built in my archdiocese in the past, say, decade. And there has been building (as ugly as they are). They're invariably in rich, suburban neighbourhoods because that's what population trends are anyway. The architecture is a whole other discussion, but the point being as populations tend to move away from decaying inner-cities, it makes sense that the existing parishes in those areas are under-used. I personally love when a traditionalist group breathes new life into a building that would otherwise be shuttered, or even torn down.

I also love that these types of parishes have a tendency to not only survive, but thrive under these conditions.

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#14
(01-13-2016, 11:48 AM)Cyriacus Wrote: Woodlawn is already pretty dicey neighborhood, honestly, but the Shrine of Christ the King is fairly close to Hyde Park and the University of Chicago, which mitigates that somewhat. I'm not sure where else the Institute could move and still retain a presence in Chicago's South Side. The further it goes south or west it has to move, the more intimidating (and often quite dangerous) it becomes.
That's what I've heard.

If I were to list all of the TLMs I've been to outside of NY, they're really a mixture.
California -
Rutherford (Napa) - This one was surrounded by a vineyard. It was a mission church, quite nice.

St. Anne's in San Diego. This was an FSSP church. Neighborhood (Logan Heights) was poor, didn't seem like the safest of areas (city-data seems to confirm this), but I had no issues arriving for Mass since there were so many people around. Either way, not the best place for an out of towner.

I was going to go to Star of the Sea in San Francisco, but our schedule didn't permit it since we needed to take mass transit to get there. So instead we went to a Latin NO Mass in the middle of the downtown area (near where the trolley cars pick you up). Not the same, but way better than the run of the mill NO. Thing is they needed security at this church. We saw some whacked out people coming in and causing a ruckus, they had to be escorted out. Of course, at that Mass, the priest announced that in the future they would only be offering the Latin Mass like once a month.


Florida
Holy Spirit in Lantana - Seemed like an OK area. Right off the highway, not much around.

Also, not that it's relevant, but I went to Disney World and of course there aren't any TLMs within 50 minutes and the times are terrible. So ended up going to Mary Queen of the Universe, at least it was an OK NO (I think). 


Maine
I've been to Immaculate Conception in Portland for an NO Mass. They offer TLM at noon, haven't been able to get there for it.  Portland is pretty nice and the area seemed decent enough.
I did go to TLM in Lewiston @ Sts Peter and Paul Church though. That area was quite run down and looked poor. Didn't see anyone around though. From what I read it's not the best of areas.

Nevada
St. Bridget in Las Vegas - This is like 10 to 15 minutes out side of the strip, the area seemed OK, but then there was what seemed to be a drunken homeless person making a ruckus and an usher had to deal with him. So I'm not quite sure how this area is. At the time it was a Saturday evening Mass (was dark when we got there). Looks like they've moved it to Sunday morning now (according to Ecclesia Dei).


Washington, DC- St. Mary Church - Fine area. Was surrounded by China town I think.


Florence, Italy
Chiesa dei Santi Michele e Gaetano - was on a fairly main street leading to Ponte Santa Trinita. This one is done by the ICKSP.  Was the first TLM outside of my home area that I've been to.


I'll be hopefully going to St. John Cantius in Chicago soon. I think that one is in a decent area of Chicago.
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#15
(01-13-2016, 01:04 PM)GangGreen Wrote: Maine
I've been to Immaculate Conception in Portland for an NO Mass. They offer TLM at noon, haven't been able to get there for it.  Portland is pretty nice and the area seemed decent enough.

I went to the traditional Mass at this Church a couple years back when I was vacationing in Maine.  A man who appeared to be homeless (and was definitely shirtless) came in and added a generally scary presence to the congregation.  I was afraid he might do something disruptive or violent any minute.  Thankfully, he didn't.  I think that was the most afraid I've ever been during Mass that something violent was about to happen.

Anyway, I can think of other places I've been to Mass that were certainly not in the best part of town: the SSPX chapel in Richmond, Virginia, comes to mind, as well as the SSPX chapel outside New Orleans. 
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#16
Weren't the price for repairs something like 10 million dollars? That's a lot of money to expend on one parish with maybe 100 regular attendees. I don't fault the diocese for not giving them that. That's basically 100000$ per parishoner.

I sincerely hope that the Institute of Christ King, will find another place to celebrate mass for these Church goers.
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#17
(01-13-2016, 01:22 PM)ermy_law Wrote:
(01-13-2016, 01:04 PM)GangGreen Wrote: Maine
I've been to Immaculate Conception in Portland for an NO Mass. They offer TLM at noon, haven't been able to get there for it.  Portland is pretty nice and the area seemed decent enough.

I went to the traditional Mass at this Church a couple years back when I was vacationing in Maine.  A man who appeared to be homeless (and was definitely shirtless) came in and added a generally scary presence to the congregation.  I was afraid he might do something disruptive or violent any minute.  Thankfully, he didn't.  I think that was the most afraid I've ever been during Mass that something violent was about to happen.

Anyway, I can think of other places I've been to Mass that were certainly not in the best part of town: the SSPX chapel in Richmond, Virginia, comes to mind, as well as the SSPX chapel outside New Orleans.

My son lives in Portland, have been the Immaculate Conception many times both OF and EF, if this is considered a bad place sign me up. I'm sorry for your experience there but I think that may have been an aberration.
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#18
I'm glad to hear my experience was out of the ordinary. The Church is beautiful. And Portland is a cool place.
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#19
(01-12-2016, 09:25 PM)austenbosten Wrote:
(01-12-2016, 05:21 PM)richgr Wrote: As much as I don't like Abp. Cupich's viewpoints, I do have to agree with Steven and also what Msgr. Pope says here: http://www.ncregister.com/blog/msgr-pope...latin-mass

It is very sad that this is happening, but it is what it is.

The very big and grave picture is being missed by Monsignor and Steven.

It's not that His Excellency Cupich is some evil-greedy bishop ala proto-Protestant Revolt from days of yore...it's the fact that Cupich and many like him, including (sadly) the Holy Father, is of the world and seeks to conform the Church to the world, instead of the other.


The numbers of the Church have been dwindling because the laity has lost the Faith. I will agree that having the TLM being offered at every parish, will not undo the damage being caused every day with wicked religious, priests, and bishops who: encourage sinners to revel in their vomit; view the Church as an organization, where message and numbers matter; and simply would thricely deny our Lord, sell Him out for thirty pieces of silver, and then crucify him.

What Traditionalists realize is that the TLM will be one of the things that will revive the Church after Her decline and tribulation.
Steven, Msgr. Pope, and I weren't responding to the "very big and grave picture." We were responding to the point being made that the "Archdiocese" wants to tear down this building. When put that way, it makes the diocese out to be some tyrannical, evil bureaucracy that has no good reason to justify its actions. But things are more complicated than that, even if it happens to be true. That's the point here. If it were an ugly novus ordo parish that was the subject here, I suspect many here would say (maybe not in these harsh words), "Let them tear it down! Good riddance."

I agree with you about everything else though.
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