Do women really care about men?
#1
I asked myself the question in the subject today and don't know the answer. Perhaps its a bad question, but here is what got me thinking. I was quite exhausted today after getting maybe 5 hours of sleep and my wife wanted to be intimate tonight. Needless to say I just "wasn't in the mood" and felt kind of bad first. I chalked it up to the tiredness, but I think I was just generally not interested. I guess my time in the feminist crusade has led me to the conclusion that women hold onto men for convenience. Look at today's divorce statistics and who initiates the divorce. Women mostly! Look at the recent election nonsense. If Trump says 1 thing about a woman right away they crucify him as a sexist. I mean can a man not disagree with a woman just because he flat out thinks she's bad at what she does or the way she acts without it having to be a gender issue? Then there is the Hillary debacle who will ultimately carry women by a large margin just because she's a woman. I just came to the realization today that I'm largely disgusted in what I see a majority behavior of women towards men. There are days I wake up that I wish I was single and living on an island by myself. At least that would be peaceful. I'm just sick and tired of listening to women b*tch and complain about their non-existent abortion / contraception "rights." They say "my body, my choice" but really mean "my body, my choice, YOU pay for it." And if heaven forbid we have another Democrat majority its just going to raise the vagina worship to the nth power.

Perhaps I shouldn't let what's going on in the world affect what goes on at home, but some days I just feel like I'm spinning my wheels going nowhere for nothing. If you look through scores of literature you always find some sappy dude waxing poetry about how great his girlfriend / fiance / wife is. I've never heard anything comparable from women and you's are supposed to be the ones "better with words" according to the "studies." Whenever these man vs women issues come up they always seem to put men at a disadvantage per some social "science" study run by either a feminist woman or no-balls man. I'm just sick and tired of the utter garbage and lies that seem a lot of women need to inflate their fragile egos and self-esteem.

I apologize in advance if anyone is offended, but I'm just aggravated that this just seems to get exponentially worse by the day.....
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#2
Honestly? I think you've got to stop reading in whatever it is you read that feeds into this kind of thinking.

Before you start off, I'm WELL aware of the current state of gender dynamics. I'm well aware of how men are constantly derided or undercut in many aspects of life. If I were to ever have a child and it was a son, I was quietly grieve inside for the current world would be after his throat from birth.

The reality is, our culture has gone downhill to the point no one believes they should respect each other or honor traditional social conventions. It's all about the individual. What is it in for ME? That's why the Church is fielding problems. People want the Church to be about THEM. People want everything about society to be about them. On some level, both sexes behave that way too.

Men and women these days don't believe they should have to submit to *anyone* and they are free agents to do as they shall please. Both take advantage of the other, but fully give their consent to do so. Feminists and masculinists aren't too different from each other, and I'm at the point where I don't believe countering feminism with that kind of philosophy is going to help us solve these problems.

There are a lot of women out there on your side. There are women who've studied these issues honestly and wrote books about how young boys are being hurt academically and socially in schools, how our current culture glorifies emasculinazation and blurring sex differences, and how women have contributed to the destruction of the family through divorce and unjust family court proceedings.

Trust me, I get tired of hearing women talk about these things too. Now it's not just women...men talk about it, too. There are many men who are pro-divorce and pro-contraception, and pro-abortion. They get that they can reap the supposed "benefits" of these calamities, too. I was at the gym the other day and had to endure listening to a trainer (male) talking to his client (female) about how awful and stupid the institution of marriage was, and how it was pointless. The trainer seemed to have a worse view of marriage, bragging about how he's been with his girlfriend for how many years and has no interest in marrying her. Apparently, not because he's not in love with her, but because "he's not going anywhere." (facepalms)

Men AND women are buying and selling this bs.
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#3
Divinesilence, if you are pushing your wife away because of the issues in modern gender relations, then you are hurting your relationship terribly.  And for what?  Because feminists are stupid.  Is that really a reason to hurt your wife?  Is she a feminist?  Or is your relationship defined by a mutual respect and love?  I sure hope it is.  I hope and pray you have something better than what the world in general offers. 

Introvert is correct.  Gender relations have dissolved into a power war between the sexes.  Both sides use each other and it is terrible.  Men are not allowed to be real men, but women have also turned themselves into something else entirely in the name of feminism.  Chivalry is dead and normal masculine behavior is not permitted in most of society.  Women who choose traditional roles are likewise denigrated.  This is terribly, desperately sad.   

Does this mean we should allow the world to corrupt our relationships or strive for something better?  I hope it means we should present a different model through our marriages: one where the sexes don't compete but complete each other.  One where honor, courage, and strength are respected in our men but women are honored and cherished as well.  One where the marital embrace is something to be shared and not an expression of dominance.  If we let the world define Catholic marriage, we are in very serious trouble.  Surely, we are called to something much, much more beautiful when we enter into this sacrament. 

Please remember: marriage is a sacrament and not a power struggle.  Treat it accordingly and God's grace will strengthen your relationship and help it to grow. 
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#4
What they said.

I also agree you need to insulate yourself from whatever is making you nuts. Stop reading, TV, whatever. Create your own happy little Catholic bubble. Appreciate your wife for who she is, and be the man you think you should be (by that I mean be a traditional man!). Revel in the joy of current and impending fatherhood.

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#5
Imnsho it serves no purpose whatsoever to make broad, sweeping, generalized statements in the form of questions like that.  None. 

Pay very close attention, ds, to what the women above have said.

I don't know (or maybe it's I don't remember) what may have happened to you regarding women in the past, ds, but whatever it was don't you think it's time to get over it and move on rather than, what seems to me, to keep picking at that particular scab and never allowing the wound to heal?
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#6
I agree with the other comments here.  I don't know what has caused you to devote a lot of your energy to discredit feminism (sorry, I didn't know what to call it?) but I think it would be a good idea to take a break.  A break would be imperative if your negative feelings towards a specific gender are beginning to influence your relationship with your wife.  Your wife is the woman with whom you have chosen to spend your life and be your spiritual partner together in this world.  She probably hasn't given you any reason to feel the way that you do.  In any relationship, there are times when the partners' wires get crossed meaning they aren't really aware of what their partner needs.  This doesn't mean that a woman doesn't care about her husband or simply using him for convenience but rather didn't know her husband is tired or something is bothering him.

As has been noted here, you'll see that there are women on your side and understand it is becoming more and more difficult to be a traditional man in contemporary times.  As introvert noted, our society has become more focused with selfishness and what (or who) can be used so that hedonistic goals can come to fruition.  It may not be a question of man versus woman but rather 'what can I get out of this individual so that I can feel good?"  Women use men for their own needs just as men continue to do the same to women.  I agree with you that some women do use men for convenience.  I had coffee with a friend last night stating she 'needed a man' that had a good stable job so that she did not have to work and have at least a month of vacation.  I sat there thinking "Poor man!"

I've been raised in a really male dominant culture so I haven't experienced "vagina worship" (I'm clueless here and I am scared to google it) to the extent mentioned here.  We have strong women but they have even stronger men.  Gender roles are still fairly traditional although other parts of society have gone to pot.  (Lots of promiscuity, abortions, high divorce rates, etc.)  However, I am aware of 'social justice warriors' rant and rave about misogyny, contraceptives and abortion or rape culture.  They are organized and pushing their agenda at a time when society has slowly been corroded.  However, this does not mean that all women wholeheartedly approve of their messages.  It is up to us to live traditionally, promote a culture with its roots in the Church and organize/educate to counter their disinformation. 

As a woman, I appreciate the men in my life and I respect traditional gender roles.  I understand that there are some tasks that are better suited to men and their male intuition.  I believe men should have strong male role models (a difficult thing to do these days due to absent fathers or women pushing men away in the parenting process) and boys should be encouraged to be great.  As for the prose and poetry, I can say from my heart that I would write works praising men.  It just wouldn't be any good.  :blush:

So, leave the feminists and their poison alone for a little bit and love your wife!   
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#7
Thanks for the comments here everyone. They helped a bit. I know I shouldn't generalize, but sometimes generalizations are true. Sure, there are always outliers but they are usually few and far in between. Did I marry a feminist? Well, I'm not sure how to answer that.....my wife is traditional in a lot aspects but I do hear some comments on occasion that make me cringe. Given that I find feminism so insufferable the least comment can send me into "red alert." It's just such an ugly philosophy of discord it makes me want to vomit. I'm not denying that men sometimes treat women poorly, but 2 wrongs don't make a right.  At what point does this nonsense end? When the whole forest has been burnt to the ground? I know there are women out there that care, but it just seem ya'll are entirely out numbered and out gunned.
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#8
(04-08-2016, 08:08 PM)divinesilence80 Wrote: Thanks for the comments here everyone. They helped a bit. I know I shouldn't generalize, but sometimes generalizations are true. Sure, there are always outliers but they are usually few and far in between. Did I marry a feminist? Well, I'm not sure how to answer that.....my wife is traditional in a lot aspects but I do hear some comments on occasion that make me cringe. Given that I find feminism so insufferable the least comment can send me into "red alert." It's just such an ugly philosophy of discord it makes me want to vomit. I'm not denying that men sometimes treat women poorly, but 2 wrongs don't make a right.  At what point does this nonsense end? When the whole forest has been burnt to the ground? I know there are women out there that care, but it just seem ya'll are entirely out numbered and out gunned.

I think the best thing to do is to address your wife directly. It doesn't matter if they're off-color remarks, malicious, meant to be a joke, etc. SHE needs to know how they make you cringe.

If there's one thing I've learned about marriage, it's to not allow ideologies, legalism, etc. to create rifts. They will become a poison.

Yes, we ARE all outnumbered. Not just women. Pretty much all devout, orthodox practicing Catholics. Heck even if you aren't a Christian and believe marriage should be reserved for heterosexual couples, you're branded a bigot. Anyone who goes against the current drain down to the cesspool is a bigot.
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#9
(04-08-2016, 08:08 PM)divinesilence80 Wrote: Thanks for the comments here everyone. They helped a bit. I know I shouldn't generalize, but sometimes generalizations are true. Sure, there are always outliers but they are usually few and far in between. Did I marry a feminist? Well, I'm not sure how to answer that.....my wife is traditional in a lot aspects but I do hear some comments on occasion that make me cringe. Given that I find feminism so insufferable the least comment can send me into "red alert." It's just such an ugly philosophy of discord it makes me want to vomit. I'm not denying that men sometimes treat women poorly, but 2 wrongs don't make a right.  At what point does this nonsense end? When the whole forest has been burnt to the ground? I know there are women out there that care, but it just seem ya'll are entirely out numbered and out gunned.

General statements are just that: statements that are generally true. Talk about "Western women" or "feminists" involve general statements. But you didn't marry "Western women" or "feminists"; you married A woman -- a woman you know, who has a name, a History, a story, desires, needs, gifts, virtues, struggles she needs to work on, etc. If you look at your wife and see "Western women" or "feminists," you're, to be blunt about it, being a bigot in the same way that a person who knows about the IQ and crime rate differences between African Americans and white Americans  would be a bigot if he were to meet an individual African American and treat him as a less intelligent criminal by virtue of his skin color. KWIM? If he were in Vegas and playing the odds, he might be a good gambler by making that sort of assumption, but dealing with people isn't akin to playing around in Vegas. It's dealing with other human beings, as individuals (whenever possible. We obviously can't do that when it comes to those who play identity politics and act as a part of a group, engage in mass movements, etc.). And in dealing with other human beings, we're supposed to be Christ-like.

I am a Western woman and I LOATHE how too many members of my sex treat and talk about men. I can't stand it! I talk about it quite a bit. Etc. But if a guy were to meet me, assume that I, as an individual, because I'm a woman, am a feminist Hillary supporter, I'd be annoyed. And if he were to treat me like crap because of his assumptions, I'd be pissed. Don't put your wife in that situation.

Each sex "uses" the other in some way because that's how we're made. We're complementary to each other. Women typically want to be rescued from bad guys and spiders and will "use" a man to come take spidey outside and kick the butt of a man who's attacking her, and men typically want their kids raised by their wives and, so, "use" woman for that purpose. As long as individual differences in each couple are accounted for and each knows what s/he's getting into and what's expected of him/her going into a marriage, then so what if they "use" each other? As long as it's done with respect and love, that's what we're here for - to be "used," to serve each other, eh? This is a lesson that can be learned just by watching chickens, ya know? It's nature. It's how God made us.

Finally, of course traditional-minded people are outgunned. The powers that be don't fund us, own the media, control our economy (through usury, fiat currencies, fractional reserve banking, and the Fed), are in control of the gateways of our culture (such as academia), etc., and we're not. It's not  "men" against all that; it's traditional people against all that, women included. George Soros isn't funding any traditional women's group; he's funding FEMEN and/or Pussy Riot. He's shipping people all over the country to disrupt Trump rallies, and the media report on those rallies in a way that makes it seem it's the "Trumpsters" who are the violent ones. And so it goes. You're falling right into the trap set up by him and his ilk, hating women in general, just as women are being brainwashed to hate men in general. Traditional people would do the world a lot more good if they'd keep all that in mind and not play their identity politics game whenever it's possible to avoid it. Men and women aren't enemies. The powers that be who are trying to make us enemies are the enemy of us ALL.

To wit: My advice is to keep abreast of what the feminists are up to and fight against it as long as you're able to live your life with peace while doing so. But separate out "feminists" from "women," and know who the real enemy is. And above all, don't treat your wife as if she's some political group. She's just a girl who loved you enough to marry you and have your child. And that you've been married a while and she still wants you sexually is a good sign. Be grateful. Get to know her again. Have a date. Reminisce with her. Remember what you felt when you married her. Go through the "Questions to Build Intimacy" with her (see below). Surprise her. But just treat her as a woman, as your wife, as an individual, and not as some "representative" of "women" or of "feminists" or of anything else. Don't punish your wife because some other women are idiots. Do you realize how radically unjust that is? And even if your wife has moments of idiocy, as most of us do (aside from me :P ), that's her own idiocy, not some collective expression. Educate her. Talk to her. Love her through it!


Questions To Build Intimacy

Set I

1. Given the choice of anyone in the world, whom would you want as a dinner guest?

2. Would you like to be famous? In what way?

3. Before making a telephone call, do you ever rehearse what you are going to say? Why?

4. What would constitute a “perfect” day for you?

5. When did you last sing to yourself? To someone else?

6. If you were able to live to the age of 90 and retain either the mind or body of a 30-year-old for the last 60 years of your life, which would you want?

7. Do you have a secret hunch about how you will die?

8. Name three things you and your partner appear to have in common.

9. For what in your life do you feel most grateful?

10. If you could change anything about the way you were raised, what would it be?

11. Take four minutes and tell your partner your life story in as much detail as possible.

12. If you could wake up tomorrow having gained any one quality or ability, what would it be?


Set II

13. If a crystal ball could tell you the truth about yourself, your life, the future or anything else, what would you want to know?

14. Is there something that you’ve dreamed of doing for a long time? Why haven’t you done it?

15. What is the greatest accomplishment of your life?

16. What do you value most in a friendship?

17. What is your most treasured memory?

18. What is your most terrible memory?

19. If you knew that in one year you would die suddenly, would you change anything about the way you are now living? Why?

20. What does friendship mean to you?

21. What roles do love and affection play in your life?

22. Alternate sharing something you consider a positive characteristic of your partner. Share a total of five items.

23. How close and warm is your family? Do you feel your childhood was happier than most other people’s?

24. How do you feel about your relationship with your mother?


Set III

25. Make three true “we” statements each. For instance, “We are both in this room feeling ... “

26. Complete this sentence: “I wish I had someone with whom I could share ... “

27. If you were going to become a close friend with your partner, please share what would be important for him or her to know.

28. Tell your partner what you like about them; be very honest this time, saying things that you might not say to someone you’ve just met.

29. Share with your partner an embarrassing moment in your life.

30. When did you last cry in front of another person? By yourself?

31. Tell your partner something that you like about them already.

32. What, if anything, is too serious to be joked about?

33. If you were to die this evening with no opportunity to communicate with anyone, what would you most regret not having told someone? Why haven’t you told them yet?

34. Your house, containing everything you own, catches fire. After saving your loved ones and pets, you have time to safely make a final dash to save any one item. What would it be? Why?

35. Of all the people in your family, whose death would you find most disturbing? Why?

36. Share a personal problem and ask your partner’s advice on how he or she might handle it. Also, ask your partner to reflect back to you how you seem to be feeling about the problem you have chosen.

Now gaze into each others’ eyes for four minutes.

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#10
your wife is your vocation.  it doesn't really matter if all the other women in the world are going to hell in a handcart.  they are not your vocation.  not your circus not your monkeys

if crusading against feminism is making it difficult to love the one God has given you to love it might be time to step away and focus on fortifying your own household
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