Brown Scapular question
#1
Some of you may recall that I made a thread a while back asking if it was acceptable to receive permission to recite the Rosary daily in order to qualify for the Sabbatine Privilege from a priest who seemed like he didn't understand the request.

What if you don't know if the traditional prayers for investiture were used?

The priest who invested me and my parents seemed knowledgeable about the process. We went with him into a separate part of the church for the prayers. I believe he had a book or some sort of paper with him. He definitely seemed to understand this more than the priest who gave me permission for the daily Rosary qualification, because he seemed prepared and didn't give a very short blessing as he would for a Rosary or a medal.

Should I simply continue on knowing that I at least made the attempt for a proper investiture from someone who seemed to know what he was doing? I don't want to get nitpicky over the details, but I also want to make sure I was formally invested.
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#2
Perhaps this may be helpful:


Quote:http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/13289b.htm

Sabbatine Privilege


The name Sabbatine Privilege is derived from the apocryphal Bull "Sacratissimo uti culmine" of John XXII, 3 March, 1322. In this Bull the pope is made to declare that the Mother of God appeared to him, and most urgently recommended to him the Carmelite Order and its confratres and consorores. The Blessed Virgin asked that John, as Christ's representative on earth, should ratify the indulgences which He had already granted in heaven (a plenary indulgence for the members of the Carmelite Order and a partial indulgence, remitting the third part of the temporal punishment due to their sins, for the members of the confraternity); she herself would graciously descend on the Saturday (Sabbath after their death and liberate and conduct to heaven all who were in purgatory. Then follow the conditions which the confratres and consorores must fulfill. At the end of the Bull the pope declares:

    Istam ergo sanctam Indulgentiam accepto, roboro et in terris confirmo, sicut, propter merita Virginis Matris, gratiose Jesus Christus concessit in coelis

    (This holy indulgence I therefore accept; I confirm and ratify it on earth, just as Jesus Christ has graciously granted it in heaven on account of the merits of the Virgin Mother).

Our first information of this Bull is derived from a work of the Carmelite Balduinus Leersius ("Collectaneum exemplorum et miraculorum" in "Bibliotheca Carmelit.", I, Orléans, 1752, p. 210), who died in 1483. The authenticity of the Bull was keenly contested especially in the seventeenth century, but was vigorously defended by the Carmelites. The chief opponents of its authenticity were Joannes Launoy and the Bollandist, Daniel Papebroch, both of whom published works against it. Today it is universally regarded by scholars as inauthentic, even the "Monumenta histor. Carmel." of the Carmelite B. Zimmerman (I, Lérins, 1907, pp. 356-63) joining in rejecting it.

In 1379, in consequence of the hostility still shown to their order and especially to its name, the Carmelites besought Urban VI to grant an indulgence of 3 years and 3 quarantines to all the faithful who designated them and their order "Ordinem et Fratres B. Mariae Genetricis Dei de Monte Carmeli" (Bullar. Carmelit. I, 141); this was granted by Urban on 26 April, 1379. It is difficult to understand why, instead of asking for this indulgence, they did not appeal to the old promise and the recent "Bulla sabbatina", if the scapular was then known and the promise to St. Simon Stock and this Bull were genuine and incontestable. While the Bull of John XXII was ratified by some later popes in the sixteenth century (cf. Bullar. Carmelit., II, 47, 141), neither the Bull itself in its wording nor its general contents were thereby declared authentic and genuine. On the contrary, the ratification by Gregory XIII on 18 September, 1577 (Bullar. Carmelit., II, 196), must be interpreted quite in the sense of the later Decree of the Holy Office. This Decree, which appeared in 1613, expresses no opinion concerning the genuineness of the Bull, but confines itself to declaring what the Carmelites may preach of its contents. The Bull forbids the painting of pictures representing, in accordance with the wording of the Bull, the Mother of God descending into purgatory (cum descensione beatae Virginis ad animas in Purgatorio liberandas). It must be also remembered that the latest authentic summary of indulgences of the Carmelite Order of 31 July, 1907 (Acta S. Sedis, XL, 753 sqq.), approved by the Congregation of Indulgences, says nothing either of the Bull of John XXII, of the indulgences granted by him, or of the Sabbatine privilege of the Carmelites. To learn the meaning and importance of the Sabbatine privilege, we may turn only to the above-mentioned Decree of the Holy Office. It was inserted in its entirety (except for the words forbidding the painting of the pictures) into the list of the indulgences and privileges of the Confraternity of the Scapular of Mount Carmel.

We reproduce here the whole passage dealing with the Sabbatine privilege, as it appears in the summary approved by the Congregation of Indulgences on 4 July, 1908. It is noteworthy that the Bull of John XXII, which was still mentioned in the previous summary approved on 1 December, 1866, is no longer referred to (cf. "Rescript. authent. S.C. Indulg.", Ratisbon, 1885, p. 475). Among the privileges, which are mentioned after the indulgences, the following occurs in the first place: "The privilege of Pope John XXII, commonly [vulgo] known as the Sabbatine, which was approved and confirmed by Clement VII ("Ex clementi", 12 August 1530), St. Pius V ("Superna dispositione", 18 Feb., 1566), Gregory XIII ("Ut laudes", 18 Sept., 1577), and others, and also by the Holy Roman General Inquisition under Paul V on 20 January, 1613, in a Decree to the following effect:

    It is permitted to the Carmelite Fathers to preach that the Christian people may piously believe in the help which the souls of brothers and members, who have departed this life in charity, have worn in life the scapular, have ever observed chastity, have recited the Little Hours [of the Blessed Virgin], or, if they cannot read, have observed the fast days of the Church, and have abstained from flesh meat on Wednesdays and Saturdays (except when Christmas falls on such days), may derive after death — especially on Saturdays, the day consecrated by the Church to the Blessed Virgin — through the unceasing intercession of Mary, her pious petitions, her merits, and her special protection.

With this explanation and interpretation, the Sabbatine privilege no longer presents any difficulties, and Benedict XIV adds his desire that the faithful should rely on it (Opera omnia, IX, Venice, 1767, pp. 197 sqq.). Even apart from the Bull and the tradition or legend concerning the apparition and promise of the Mother of God the interpretation of the Decree cannot be contested.

The Sabbatine privilege thus consists essentially in the early liberation from purgatory, through the special intercession and petition of Mary, which she graciously exercises in favour of her devoted servants preferentially — as we may assume — on the day consecrated to her, Saturday. Furthermore, the conditions for the gaining of the privilege are of such a kind as justify a special trust in the assistance of Mary. It is especially required of all who wish to share in the privilege that they faithfully preserve their chastity, and recite devoutly each day the Little Hours of the Blessed Virgin. However, all those who are bound to read their Breviary, fulfil the obligation of reciting the Little Hours by reading their Office. Persons who cannot read must (instead of reciting the Little Hours) observe all the fasts prescribed by the Church as they are kept in their home diocese or place of residence, and must in addition abstain from flesh meat on all Wednesdays and Saturdays of the year, except when Christmas falls on one of these days. The obligation to read the Little Hours and to abstain from flesh meat on Wednesday and Saturday may on important grounds be changed for other pious works; the faculty to sanction this change was granted to all confessors by Leo XIII in the Decree of the Congregation of Indulgences of 11 (14) June, 1901.

And to add:


Quote:http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09294a.htm

Little Office of Our Lady

A liturgical devotion to the Blessed Virgin, in imitation of, and in addition to, the Divine Office.

It is first heard of in the middle of the eighth century at Monte Cassino. According to Cardinal Bona, who quotes from a manuscript of Peter the Deacon (twelfth century), there was, in addition to the Divine Office, another "which it is customary to perform in honour of the Holy Mother of God, which Zachary the Pope [d. 752] commanded under strict precept to the Cassinese Monastery." This would seem to indicate that some form of the Office of Our Lady was already extant and, indeed, we hear of an Office in her honour composed by St. Ildephonsus, who lived about the end of the seventh century. The Eastern Church, too, possesses an Office of the B.V.M., attributed to St. John Damascene (c. 730). But though various Offices in honour of Our Lady were in existence earlier, it is probable that the Little Office, as a part of the liturgy, did not come into general use before the tenth century; and it is not unlikely that its diffusion is largely due to the marked devotion to the Blessed Virgin which is characteristic of the Church in England under the guidance of St. Dunstan and St. Ethelwold. Certainly during the tenth century, an Office of the Blessed Virgin is mentioned at Augsburg, at Verdun, and at Eisiedeln; while already in the following century there were at least two versions of her "Hours" extant in England. In the eleventh century we learn from St. Peter Damian that it was already commonly recited amongst the secular clergy of Italy and France, and it was through his influence that the practice of reciting it in choir, in addition to the Great Office, was introduced into several Italian monasteries. At Cluny the Office of the B.V.M. was not introduced till the end of the eleventh century, and then only as a devotion for the sick monks. In the twelfth century came the foundation of the Orders of Cîteaux and Prémontré, of which the latter only retained the Little Office in addition to the Divine Office. The Austin Canons also retained it, and, perhaps through their influence, in the course of the twelfth and thirteenth centuries, it developed from a private devotion into part of the daily duty of the secular clergy as well. By the fourteenth century the recital of the Little Office had come to be an almost universal practice and was regarded as obligatory on all the clergy. This obligation remained until St. Pius V removed it by the Bull "Quod a nobis" of 1568. At the present time, however, it is recited on certain days by several of the older orders, and it serves, instead of the Greater Office, as the liturgical prayer of lay brothers and lay sisters in some of the contemplative orders, and of the members of most of the congregations of women engaged in active work.

Down to the Reformation it formed a large part of the "Primer or Lay-folk's Prayer-book", and was customarily recited by the devout laity, by whom the practice was continued for long afterwards among the persecuted Catholics. Today it is recited daily by Dominican, Carmelite, Augustinian, and by large numbers of the Franciscan, Tertiaries, as well as by many pious laymen who desire to take part in the liturgical prayer of the Church. It is worth noting that the form of the Little Office of Our Lady has varied considerably at different periods and in different places. The earlier versions varied very considerably, chiefly as regards the hymns and antiphons used: in England in medieval times the main differences seem to have been between the Sarum and York Uses. Since the time of St. Pius V, that most commonly recited has been the version of the reformed Breviary of that pope. In this version, which suffers somewhat from the classicism of the sixteenth century, are to be found the seven "Hours", as in the Greater Office. At Matins, after the versicles follow the invitatory "Ave Maria, gratia plena, Dominus tecum" with the "Venite" then the hymn "Quem terra, pontus, sidera"; then three groups of psalms, each with their antiphons, of which one group is said on Sundays, Mondays, and Thursdays, the second on Tuesdays and Fridays, the third on Wednesdays and Saturdays. Next follow three lessons with responsories and (except in Lent and Advent) the "Te Deum". At Lauds, there are the eight psalms of the Divine Office for Sundays, sung to five antiphons. Then the Little Chapter, and the hymn "O Gloriosa Virginum". Next a versicle and the canticle "Benedictus" with its antiphon. Lastly, the prayer and commemoration of the saints. In each of the four Little Hours the hymn "Memento rerum conditor" immediately follows the versicles; then three psalms are recited, under one of the antiphons of Lauds; then are said the Little Chapter, versicles, and a prayer. At Vespers, after the versicles and five psalms with their antiphons, follow the Little Chapter, the hymn "Ave Maris stella", a short versicle, and the canticle "Magnificat" with its antiphon; then the prayers as at Lauds. Compline begins with special versicles, then follow three psalms without antiphons, then the hymn "Memento rerum conditor", a Little Chapter, a versicle, the canticle "Nunc Dimittis", versicles, a prayer, and the Benediction. After the hours are recited the "Pater Noster" and the proper antiphon of Our Lady for the season. This last, the antiphons of the psalms and canticles and the Little Chapters are the only parts of the office that vary with the seasons. Pope Leo XIII granted (17 Nov., 1887), to those who recite the whole Office of Our Lady, an indulgence daily of seven years and seven quarantines, and a plenary indulgence once a month; to those who recite Matins and Lauds only, a daily indulgence of three hundred days; and (8 Dec., 1897) to those who recite Vespers and Compline only, and for each Hour, an indulgence of fifty days.
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#3
Investiture in the Scapular is a process that is isolated from the "Sabbatine Privilege". It is in the Book of Blessings. Sometimes parishes have them on July 16. Other times it's better to print out the blessing and bring it to the priest :)

Of course there's a traditional investment and a newer edition, but both "work" and both can be performed by any priest (once it was limited to Carmelite priests).

http://www.carmelites.ie/BlessingofScapulars.pdf

http://www.carmelite.org/documents/layca...ntrite.pdf

http://www.windsorlatinmass.org/wtnews/160710.pdf

http://te-igitur.blogspot.com/2012/07/sc...armel.html
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#4
(04-11-2017, 11:31 PM)Macarius Wrote: Investiture in the Scapular is a process that is isolated from the "Sabbatine Privilege". It is in the Book of Blessings. Sometimes parishes have them on July 16. Other times it's better to print out the blessing and bring it to the priest :)

Of course there's a traditional investment and a newer edition, but both "work" and both can be performed by any priest (once it was limited to Carmelite priests).
Just to clarify, what I meant was:

I was invested quite a while ago. More recently, I was granted permission to recite the Rosary daily instead of the Little Office. The latter priest seemed unsure of what I was asking about, so I made a thread a while back asking if I should ask a different priest. The general consensus was to simply accept it because I took the initiative to ask for permission. As for the former priest, I don't recall the prayers he said, but he seemed knowledgeable about the investiture. Should I simply trust that my attempts to be validly invested will be honored, regardless of the format he used?
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#5
I think you should trust in the mercy of God, who sees the good will of His children and will be more than generous in how He distributes His blessings.
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#6
(04-12-2017, 12:00 AM)Poche Wrote: I think you should trust in the mercy of God, who sees the good will of His children and will be more than generous in how He distributes His blessings.
Great answer. Thank you, Poche. :)
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