Orthodox Rosary
#1
I know that the majority of people here are Catholics, but has anyone heard of a devotion called the "Rule of the Theotokos"?  To me, it seems like an Orthodox version of the Rosary (obviously they claim to have had the Rosary first...)

So how legitimate is this?  I might consider taking this up as another variety of the Rosary devotion (never can have to much Marian devotion)

http://themasterbeadsman.blogspot.com/20...aphim.html

http://themasterbeadsman.blogspot.com/20...ii-st.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_of_the_Theotokos
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#2
Orthodox don't claim to have had the Rosary first. The Rosary is a post-schism devotion given to St. Dominic.

There are people on the internet who claim to pray some sort of Orthodox Rosary, but this isn't widespread. Orthodox prayer seeks to root out images and use of imagination. So the Rosary doesn't work.

I've never heard of this Rule of the Theotokos. Maybe others have. The Jesus Prayer is the primary Orthodox prayer, aside from the morning and evening rule (and various akathists -- like Catholic litanies -- and canons).
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#3
I looked at that Wiki you linked and, despite being very sympathetic to Orthodoxy, I'm not buying the attempted appropriation of the Rosary. It smacks of revisionist history to me.
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#4
(05-02-2017, 09:46 PM)ermy_law Wrote: There are people on the internet who claim to pray some sort of Orthodox Rosary, but this isn't widespread. Orthodox prayer seeks to root out images and use of imagination. So the Rosary doesn't work.
Why is that? The right use of imagination can help us in prayer (it helps me a lot with the Rosary) and they have all those icons, so I don't understand.
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#5
(05-02-2017, 09:51 PM)In His Love Wrote:
(05-02-2017, 09:46 PM)ermy_law Wrote: There are people on the internet who claim to pray some sort of Orthodox Rosary, but this isn't widespread. Orthodox prayer seeks to root out images and use of imagination. So the Rosary doesn't work.
Why is that? The right use of imagination can help us in prayer (it helps me a lot with the Rosary) and they have all those icons, so I don't understand.

Because images can lead to spiritual delusion. While I have not read this article in detail, it tends to hit the high points, and it addresses your question about icons: http://www.pravmir.com/article_545.html

Edit - I've now read the article and it summarizes the answer quite well, although I hadn't intended to post something with anti-Latin polemics, which the article hints at (although does not present so strongly as other explanations one might find!)
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#6
"In other words, according to St. Ignatii (Bryanchaninov), purposefully creating images in one’s mind, and even accepting those appearing spontaneously, is not only dangerous spiritually, but can also lead to the damage of the soul, or psychological problems, “which,” he says, “has happened to many.”  Undoubtedly, here St. Ignatii refers to the spirituality of some Western saints: “Do not play with your salvation, do not.  Take up the reading of the New Testament and the Holy Fathers of the Orthodox Church, but not of Teresa and other Western crazies…” (25)  But cases of mental disorders facilitated by improper prayer or state of mind are also known in various Orthodox literature, especially paterikons. "

Aaaand I'm done.

If we were all as 'crazy' as St. Teresa, this world would be a much better place.
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#7
That would be the anti-Latin polemics that I mentioned. Whatever you think of the presentation, that is the answer to your question. Every religion has their "crazies," though!
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#8
That's true. I have a much different take on it than they do, though. God gave us an imagination and it's a beautiful thing if it's used properly. It helps me a lot in prayer.
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#9
(05-02-2017, 09:46 PM)ermy_law Wrote: Orthodox don't claim to have had the Rosary first. The Rosary is a post-schism devotion given to St. Dominic.

There are people on the internet who claim to pray some sort of Orthodox Rosary, but this isn't widespread. Orthodox prayer seeks to root out images and use of imagination. So the Rosary doesn't work.

I've never heard of this Rule of the Theotokos. Maybe others have. The Jesus Prayer is the primary Orthodox prayer, aside from the morning and evening rule (and various akathists -- like Catholic litanies -- and canons).

I will take your word for it, but it was this link which issued the claim to the prayer being of eastern origin https://orthodoxwiki.org/Rosary. Most of what I had read about it stated that it was rather unknown except in Russia. They routinely mention Seraphim of Sarov as having performed some Rosary-esque devotion, whether this is just saying 150 Hail Marys or not, I don't know.  Whether or not is "authentic" is really of no concern to me, it makes you wonder if people complained and said the prayers that others had composed weren't traditional enough back when they were composing them.

Quote:If we were all as 'crazy' as St. Teresa, this world would be a much better place.

Agreed!
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#10
It is possible that it is a parallel development inherited from Egyptian monasticism, where Our Fathers and prayers to the Theotokos said on a prayer rope replaced the recitation of the Psalter among monks who had not or could not memorize the psalms, or who added this devotion as a penitential discipline. This is really the origin of the Western Rosary, too, pious legends aside.

The other likely possibility is that it was absorbed into Slavic Orthodoxy (it seems largely unknown outside of the Slavic world) from the West in what is now Ukraine in the 17th-18th century; many Western devotions were practiced by Eastern Christians in that region. The "dividing lines" between Roman Rite and Byzantine Rite and  between Poles, Slovaks, Romanians, Rusyns, Ukrainians, Lithuanians, Byelorussians, Russians, and their nigh-infinite subdivisions make many of the "official narratives" a bit suspect. To this day you will find Ukrainian Orthodox (Moscow Patriarchate, even) churches with statues that look an awful lot like Our Lady of Grace in front of the iconostasis, and many of the Roman Rite parishes have very Orthodox icons.

I don't know a lot about it, but there was a printing house in Venice that published devotional literature for Orthodox Christians; these devotions included things like the Stations, the 15 prayers of St. Brigitte, etc. St. Nicodemus of the Holy Mountain translated St. Ignatius's Spiritual Exercises into Greek! St. Dmitri of Rostov even defended the Immaculate Conception and formed brotherhoods that took the "Bloody Vow," which involved vowing to defend the IC doctrine to the point of martyrdom.

As with virtually every issue between the Orthodox and the Catholic Churches, there is ALWAYS more to the story than is commonly believed...
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