Two different accounts of creation in Genesis
#1
Hey Guys,

My son is asking about why there are two different accounts of creation in Genesis.

As Catholics, how are we to interpret this?

Thanks!
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#2
(02-09-2018, 02:07 AM)Sacred Heart lover Wrote: Hey Guys,

My son is asking about why there are two different accounts of creation in Genesis.

As Catholics, how are we to interpret this?

Thanks!

What does he mean?
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#3
(02-09-2018, 10:45 AM)austenbosten Wrote:
(02-09-2018, 02:07 AM)Sacred Heart lover Wrote: Hey Guys,

My son is asking about why there are two different accounts of creation in Genesis.

As Catholics, how are we to interpret this?

Thanks!

What does he mean?
I assume he's concerned about the fact that Chapter 1 of Genesis contains the 'standard' seven day creation story, with Adam and Eve created together as the crown of creation just before God rests, and Chapter 2 contains an entirely different, contradictory story in which Adam is created first, then all the animals, and only at the end is Eve created as a companion for Adam.
Jovan-Marya of the Immaculate Conception Weismiller, T.O.Carm.

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Deum timete, regem honorificate.
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#4
It doesn't sound like two different accounts to me. Chapter 2 is simply reiterating what was said in chp.1 and recapping. While setting up the scenario of how it was in the present for them, this leads us up to and entering into this next event. The importance of stating how things were under obedience and what the order was in relationship to Man and Woman is significant. The first chapter does not elaborate as to order concerning Adam and Eve, but simply states: Man was created in "our likeness " (male and female), God and the heavenly Beings. Chp2 is more of a quick summary. But the first heavenly being He created was Wisdom. And in Sirach, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes , Wisdom of Solomon , Wisdom is referred to as she. Showing the position of given roles as to man being the head of woman. Eve was Adams right hand lady she fashioned as his counterpart- as Wisdom is the Words counterpart. For Wisdom was the first of the Word's works and is from the Word she was made. Just as Eve was made from Adam.
Wisdom was created before the Angels. She was poured forth upon all His works:
In Praise of Wisdom

1 All wisdom comes from the Lord
and is with him for ever.
2
The sand of the sea, the drops of rain,
and the days of eternity—who can count them?
3
The height of heaven, the breadth of the earth,
the abyss, and wisdom—who can search them out?
4
Wisdom was created before all things,
and prudent understanding from eternity.
6
The root of wisdom—to whom has it been revealed?
Her clever devices—who knows them?
8
There is One who is wise, greatly to be feared,
sitting upon his throne.
9
The Lord himself created wisdom;
he saw her and apportioned her,
he poured her out upon all his works.
10
She dwells with all flesh according to his gift,
and he supplied her to those who love him.

This will lead us to WHY Lucifer was cast out of heaven. In deceiving Eve he first has to reject wisdom, this in thought, which is the beginning of all actions.
Ezekiel 28:13
“You were the signet of perfection,
full of wisdom
and perfect in beauty.
13
You were in Eden, the garden of God;
every precious stone was your covering,
carnelian, topaz, and jasper,
chrysolite, beryl, and onyx,
sapphire, carbuncle, and emerald;
and wrought in gold were your settings
and your engravings.
On the day that you were created
they were prepared.
14
With an anointed guardian cherub I placed you;
you were on the holy mountain of God;
in the midst of the stones of fire you walked.
15
You were blameless in your ways
from the day you were created,
till iniquity was found in you.
16
In the abundance of your trade
you were filled with violence, and you sinned;
so I cast you as a profane thing from the mountain of God,
and the guardian cherub drove you out
from the midst of the stones of fire.
17
Your heart was proud because of your beauty;
you corrupted your wisdom for the sake of your splendor.
This is about Lucifer. God gave free will to all His created beings I do not need to tell anyone here that.
Deeper meaning concerning this Ezekiel prophecy concerns a future king who will embody satan. Tyre is a place in ancient
biblical times , but is a man for a future time. Tyre means: strong and sharp he is revealed in revelation13. That is for
another time.
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#5
I’ve always thought Chapter 2 simply “zooms in” and provides details lacking in Chapter 1.
"I am a Christian, and indeed a Roman Catholic, so that I do not expect ‘history’ to be anything but a ‘long defeat’ — though it contains (and in a legend may contain more clearly and movingly) some samples or glimpses of final victory." -J.R.R. Tolkien

"I know quite well that, to you as to me, the Church which once felt like a refuge, now often feels like a trap. There is nowhere else to go! (I wonder if this desperate feeling, the last state of loyally hanging on, was not, even more often than is actually recorded in the Gospels, felt by Our Lord’s followers in His earthly life-time?) I think there is nothing to do but pray, for the Church, the Vicar of Christ, and for ourselves; and meanwhile to exercise the virtue of loyalty, which indeed only becomes a virtue when one is under pressure to desert it." -J.R.R. Tolkien

"There is none so blind as he who will not agree with me." -someone else
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#6
I like St. Augustine's explanation in Book 6 of his "Literal Meaning of Genesis."

On the first account of the creation of man, he explains the idea that the six days represent not literal days, but a scheme or plan of creation--the days are just a symbolic ordering. The actual creation during those “days” was instantaneous, but of everything in potency and causation, not necessarily their final visible form (basically the Big Bang theory).  The final forms would be shaped later over time, just as God continues today to shape mountains and rivers and new life, etc. (this seems to work with some evolution theories). The second creation account is therefore the actual formation of man which St. Augustine places after the seventh day:

St. Augustine:

Quote:There can be no doubt, then, that the work whereby man was formed from the slime of the earth and a wife fashioned for him from his side belongs not to that creation by which all thing were made together, after completing which, God rested, but to that work of God which takes place with the unfolding of the ages as He works even now.
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#7
(02-09-2018, 05:04 PM)SaintSebastian Wrote: I like St. Augustine's explanation in Book 6 of his "Literal Meaning of Genesis."

On the first account of the creation of man, he explains the idea that the six days represent not literal days, but a scheme or plan of creation--the days are just a symbolic ordering. The actual creation during those “days” was instantaneous, but of everything in potency and causation, not necessarily their final visible form (basically the Big Bang theory).  The final forms would be shaped later over time, just as God continues today to shape mountains and rivers and new life, etc. (this seems to work with some evolution theories). The second creation account is therefore the actual formation of man which St. Augustine places after the seventh day:

St. Augustine:

Quote:There can be no doubt, then, that the work whereby man was formed from the slime of the earth and a wife fashioned for him from his side belongs not to that creation by which all thing were made together, after completing which, God rested, but to that work of God which takes place with the unfolding of the ages as He works even now.

In a sense St. Augustine's (third) view (he gave it several attempts), is the most metaphysically-satisfying notion.

Creation is the production of something (either actually or potentially) from nothing (i.e. no prexisting subject). "Making" is the process of then manipulating and arranging matter (creating actual things from potential things, using previously existing matter).

The very idea that God would create over a period of time (in that strict sense) is not impossible, but does not square well with the notion that God does not do anything useless.

The six-day account is not "Creation" but God creating everything, including time, then arranging it through secondary causes. That matches Gn 2.4, in fact : "These are the generations of the heaven and the earth, when they were created, in the day that the Lord God made the heaven and the earth."

Genesis 2 doesn't conflict, but rather is exists to concentrate less on the continuum and more on things from the perspective of man. For instance, in Gn 2.8, while the making of Paradise is mentioned after the making of man (Gn 2.7) it is clear that Paradise existed before man (Man was made in and thus "placed in" Paradise, so the place where he was made had to precede what came after).

All of that production was for man, who could then use and appreciate it to intellectually and voluntarily seek God.

The real problem with Genesis 1-3 is to look at it as modern literature. It is not. It is Mosaic, Hebrew literature. Just as when we read Beowulf we don't try to apply the notion of a modern novel to it, so with this passage of scripture it has to be understood in the light it was written, not our pre-conceived ideas.

If we fail to do this we read it like the fundamentalist Protestants (who logically must if it is their only rule of Faith).

We will thus assert as dogmatic (something even the Church does not demand) that Genesis 1 recounts a literal six 24-hour day period of "Creation". We would hold that despite that Genesis 2's plainly contradicts this such a literal reading. For instance, "day" or "yom" in Hebrew in Gn 1-2 is used to mean variously a 12-hr period, a 24-hr period, the whole process of Creation and its adornment, an indefinite singular moment in the future which signifies a yet more distant moment an unknown time later.

We would hold as dogma that the flood of Noah was global, despite that this is not the common Catholic opinion, and is rejected by nearly all Catholic scholars (well before Modernism). If you need proof of that just read the 1910 Catholic Encyclopedia article on the subject.

In short, we have to read the Bible as what it claims to be. It is a true and correct history of the Beginning. It is in no way false or a mere myth. But it is a Hebrew account of history written as a Hebrew of about 3500 years ago would write it.
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#8
Thank you, both SaintSebastian and MagisterMusicae! That's the sort of explanation I was hoping someone someone would post, since it is glaringly obvious that in a literal reading the two accounts are absolutely contradictory.
Jovan-Marya of the Immaculate Conception Weismiller, T.O.Carm.

Vive le Christ-roi! Vive le roi, Louis XX!
Deum timete, regem honorificate.
Kansan by birth! Albertan by choice! Jayhawk by the Grace of God!
“Qui me amat, amet et canem meum. (Who loves me will love my dog.)” 
St Bernard of Clairvaux

My Blog 'Musings of an Old Curmudgeon'
FishEaters Group on MeWe
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#9
(02-09-2018, 05:58 PM)jovan66102 Wrote: Thank you, both SaintSebastian and MagisterMusicae! That's the sort of explanation I was hoping someone someone would post, since it is glaringly obvious that in a literal reading the two accounts are absolutely contradictory.

Yes, thank you to everyone for trying to help.  He's at a Jesuit school and I'm so grateful to have friends I can turn to for answers since there is sooooo much disinformation out there!
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