Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes
#47
(05-29-2018, 10:25 PM)Paul Wrote:
(05-29-2018, 10:03 PM)pabbie Wrote: But regarding canonizations, the quotes I provided in my last post, along with every other reference I have ever read on the subject, all say the same thing - canonizations are infallible, no exceptions. These quotes fall under the everyday teaching of the Church (the ordinary magisterium), which is itself infallible by definition. If Pope Francis is a true Vicar of Christ, then his upcoming canonization cannot be questioned.

But what does canonisation mean? Is the Church only saying this person is in heaven, or is the Church saying the things this person did during his life are worthy of emulation, and if you do them, you will go to heaven? I'd say the Church is only guaranteeing the first, particularly with the changes to the process such that any whiff of unorthodoxy put an end to the process. Saying Paul VI is in heaven doesn't mean we have to think that his promulgation of the new Mass was good.

The ordinary magisterium is not necessarily infallible. We owe it our consideration, but there's no way that Amoris lætitia and its implied approval of Communion for the unrepentant adulterer is infallible. And it's certainly not infallible when it contradicts past teachings - see John Paul II's opinions on the death penalty.
 
Here is the definition from, "A Catholic Dictionary", from the 1940s. It's pretty self-explanatory. It officially approves of heroic virtue of the Saint and by insisting on public honor, confirms that the soul of the Saint has been saved.

Canonization - A public and official declaration of the heroic virtue of a person and the inclusion of his or her name in the canon (role or register) of the Saints. Beatification having been accomplished, it must be proved that two miracles have been subsequently wrought at the intercession of the Beatus; the tests and examination are as rigorous as those which have gone before, and the miracles are discussed in three meetings of the congregation of rites; there are required two things to be proved; what the candidate was formally or equivalently beatified, and has worked two (or if equivalently beatified, three) miracles subsequent to the beatification. The canonization is then carried out solemnly in St. Peter's by the pope in person, wherein the bull of canonization is read and a mass sung in honor of the Saint. Canonization involves that the same not only may but must receive public honor; a day is appointed for his feast and a liturgical office composed therefore; his relics are publicly venerated, treasures and alters dedicated in his honor, statues or pictures displayed in churches, and prayers to have made publicly. This judgment of the Church is infallible and irreformable. Owing to the amount of careful work involved and the sumptuous scale of the final ceremony, canonization is extremely costly process....
 
If you look in any Catholic book on the ordinary magisterium (the continuous, unchanged teaching of the Church), all books say it is infallible. I could provide many quotes and they all say it. So if we see something erroneous, the only logical answer is that it cannot possibly be part of the ordinary magisterium.
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Messages In This Thread
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-10-2018, 06:18 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-11-2018, 01:25 AM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-11-2018, 01:26 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-14-2018, 05:07 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-15-2018, 02:59 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-12-2018, 08:42 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-13-2018, 12:11 AM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-29-2018, 10:25 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-30-2018, 01:11 AM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by pabbie - 05-30-2018, 01:12 AM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-30-2018, 02:19 AM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-30-2018, 09:02 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-30-2018, 02:16 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 05-31-2018, 01:10 AM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-01-2018, 09:52 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-02-2018, 08:11 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-03-2018, 02:56 AM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-12-2018, 03:54 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-12-2018, 05:17 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-14-2018, 10:08 AM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-14-2018, 02:14 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-14-2018, 11:04 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-15-2018, 12:16 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-18-2018, 03:46 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-18-2018, 05:25 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-15-2018, 12:14 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-14-2018, 02:21 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-14-2018, 02:39 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-14-2018, 02:35 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-14-2018, 02:42 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-14-2018, 03:01 PM
RE: Vatican canonizes un-Catholic popes - by Paul - 06-14-2018, 04:54 PM



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