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#11
I'm sorry, but all I have read so far is opinions based on exit polls rather than solid numbers. Both here in this thread and on Facebook. What are the numbers? :shamrock: :shamrock: :shamrock:
"The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of the Conservatives is to prevent the mistakes from being corrected." - G. K. Chesterton
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#12
(05-25-2018, 09:04 PM)jovan66102 Wrote:
(05-25-2018, 09:02 PM)For Petes Sake Wrote: Of course a country that voted for sodomy also voted to murder their children, no surprise. This is what democracy gives you.

True. I wonder how Catholics who still believe in the evil that is democracy justify it?

A democratic system is not intrinsically evil.  Democracy only does this if the consciences of the people are improperly formed.  You could just as easily have an evil monarchy.  In fact, you're more likely to have an evil monarchy than an evil democracy, since all you need is the monarch to be an evil person, but in a democracy, you need 50% + 1 person to be evil, and of like evil.
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#13
(05-25-2018, 09:48 PM)HailGilbert Wrote: I'm sorry, but all I have read so far is opinions based on exit polls rather than solid numbers. Both here in this thread and on Facebook. What are the numbers? :shamrock: :shamrock: :shamrock:

Counting won't begin until Saturday morning, with results expected Saturday evening.  There are only exit polls at the moment.
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#14
Though darkness seems to have won the day, we know the final outcome.
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#15
                             Too dejected to talk about it.
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#16
(05-25-2018, 10:05 PM)Melkite Wrote:
(05-25-2018, 09:04 PM)jovan66102 Wrote:
(05-25-2018, 09:02 PM)For Petes Sake Wrote: Of course a country that voted for sodomy also voted to murder their children, no surprise. This is what democracy gives you.

True. I wonder how Catholics who still believe in the evil that is democracy justify it?

A democratic system is not intrinsically evil.  Democracy only does this if the consciences of the people are improperly formed.  You could just as easily have an evil monarchy.  In fact, you're more likely to have an evil monarchy than an evil democracy, since all you need is the monarch to be an evil person, but in a democracy, you need 50% + 1 person to be evil, and of like evil.

Not intrinsically evil but it is inferior to other forms of government. Our evil governments cannot be fixed, only destroyed and replaced. An evil monarch just has to die.
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#17
The modern versions of democracy have only been around for not even 250 years and yet one would be hard pressed to find a single so-called democratic government that's not corrupt. Just a thought.

Anyway, Western society is gravely ill and frankly, the modern governments we have only encourage the sickness to grow worse. It's the perfect example of when the inmates run the asylum. Allowing the fickle masses to make such decisions. I'm not sure if we'll ever see any kind of reversal in our lifetimes short some catastrophic event.
Blood of Christ, relief of the burdened, save us.

“It is my design to die in the brew house; let ale be placed in my mouth when I am expiring, that when the choirs of angels come, they may say, “Be God propitious to this drinker.” – St. Columbanus, A.D. 612
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#18
(05-25-2018, 10:44 PM)For Petes Sake Wrote: Not intrinsically evil but it is inferior to other forms of government. Our evil governments cannot be fixed, only destroyed and replaced. An evil monarch just has to die.

And hope that they didn't raise their successor in their evil, and that their successor in turn doesn't do likewise.  

I don't trust monarchy to care for the people.  I don't understand why some trads are so enchanted by it.  True, once a society heads in the wrong direction, it will be harder to turn the whole thing around than it is for a chance good monarch to replace a bad one.  Other than that one point, I don't see anything superior about a monarchy to a republican form of government.
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#19
(05-25-2018, 11:11 PM)Melkite Wrote:
(05-25-2018, 10:44 PM)For Petes Sake Wrote: Not intrinsically evil but it is inferior to other forms of government. Our evil governments cannot be fixed, only destroyed and replaced. An evil monarch just has to die.

And hope that they didn't raise their successor in their evil, and that their successor in turn doesn't do likewise.  

I don't trust monarchy to care for the people.  I don't understand why some trads are so enchanted by it.  True, once a society heads in the wrong direction, it will be harder to turn the whole thing around than it is for a chance good monarch to replace a bad one.  Other than that one point, I don't see anything superior about a monarchy to a republican form of government.

I'd say both have their faults. One would think a good populace + poor ruler is best for a democratic government as long as the people still hold real power (rather than electing corrupted representatives). Whereas when the populace is poor then a good ruler can much more quickly turn things around rather than relying on the bad populace to elect good rulers who individually have quite limited powers anyway. A bad populace will quite quickly erode the country into what we see today. It literally all happened within 50 or so years with how many different rulers?

Of course we can also look at the Church and see what bad rulers can do in a monarchy type system. Although there is more hope where a Saintly Pope can turn things around, if we're lucky enough to get one.

Either way, none are perfect. I don't see a monarchy as being a magic bullet. Also, realize that many trad monarchists hold democracy with skepticism because of the period it came out of.
Blood of Christ, relief of the burdened, save us.

“It is my design to die in the brew house; let ale be placed in my mouth when I am expiring, that when the choirs of angels come, they may say, “Be God propitious to this drinker.” – St. Columbanus, A.D. 612
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#20
I am absolutely heartbroken by this news. I've marked the day Ireland made this horrid decision on my calendar for next year already. I'll pray and fast every year going forward - as I have committed to doing for Roe v. Wade - on this day for the souls of those children who will be killed because of this decision. I invite you all to join me as well. Devastating result although, sadly, I'm not surprised.
I am in the process of discerning my vocation with the help of my priest. If you would like to read my thoughts as I progress through this process of discernment feel free to visit my blog: https://walkingthelittleway.com
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