Is the default destination of human beings Hell?
#31
By rising to regular life I mean that they enjoy perfect natural happiness, only lacking the supernatural life and happiness which cone from sanctifying grace.

Other than that I can't really say why God keeps all humans alive.
Surréxit Dóminus vere, Alleluia!
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#32
(06-16-2018, 04:25 PM)Dominicus Wrote: By rising to regular life I mean that they enjoy perfect natural happiness, only lacking the supernatural life and happiness which cone from sanctifying grace.

Other than that I can't really say why God keeps all humans alive.

I imagine the latter can't be known without a specific revelation.  I don't think there is anything in nature that could lead man's reason to devise why God made that choice.

If regular life is enjoying perfect natural happiness, I have a hard time understanding that as a part of hell.  Is Limbo defined as a part of hell?  Do any theologians make a reasonable argument that it could be a separate place of its own?
I have resigned myself to the reality that I shall have no peace or joy should I continue to exist for eternity.  The question of deism or Christianity no longer matters.  I hope that Christianity is a farce, and that when I die, my consciousness will cease to exist.  In the meantime, I ask the Theotokos to be at my side at my judgement and ask her to intercede to, as I beg, Christ to have mercy on me and to allow me to cease to exist when I die.
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#33
For the OP.  

I don't think, as far as I am aware, that Hell was our "default setting".  The Most Holy Trinity has made all persons, you, me, all the folks on this forum and all the Angels for eternal beatitude and the glory of seeing the Face of God.  Not a single one of us can  understand the immense beauty that fills the soul of one of God's blessed ones.  The Saints in Heaven relish in a joy inexplicable to anyone of us.  This was intended to be the default of men.

What this thread is really developing into is a conversation about why God allows certain evils and certain pains to inflict certain individuals and to others, no.  The problem of evil, in short.  

I have nothing really new to add to this thread, since my understanding of true theology is pretty mediocre.  As far as I am concerned, the current destination of all those who die without baptism is Hell, in the ancient understanding of that word.  For those who die with actual mortal sin on their souls, this means eternal damnation, the lose of their immortal souls (which, by the by, even pagans believed this, the immortality of the soul, that is.  Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, Seneca and I am sure many others, all of whom were faithless pagans, knew, based solely upon reason and logical argument, that the soul was immortal.  So, you have no excuses if you fail to believe this.  Even pagans believe this.)  For those who die with Original Sin only, they descend into the Limbo of the Infants.  This is a place of perfect natural happiness, as has been stated on this thread.  For the Souls of the Just who lived before Christ, they awaited in the Limbo of the Fathers.  Their souls, being filled with Faith, Hope, Charity and Perfect Contrition, were saved.  However, since Our Lord hadn't yet shed His Most Precious Blood for the redemption of men, they had to wait.  This location is now completely empty.  No one is here.  For those who die in mortal sin, even just one of which they are aware and for which they are not contrite, on the moment of their death they descend into eternal and unquenchable Hellfire, which was prepared for the devil and his angels, where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth, where worm dieth not.  This is the second death, this is eternal death.  For those who die with the stain of sin upon their souls, but, who repented and were saved, they are cast into the fires of Purgatory.  Here, these souls suffer the same as the souls in Hell, the only differences being that the Poor Souls have the consolation of salvation, and the knowledge that their sufferings will cease.

That is what "Hell" looks like, geographically.

Limbo of the Fathers (Empty)
Limbo of the Infants (the souls of those who die with the lack of sanctifying grace but who have not committed actual sin)
Purgatory (where the souls of those who loved God, but have not completely made reparation for their sin burn out their impurities)
Eternal Hell, Gehenna, The Inferno (where the souls of the damned shall reside for all of eternity, as long as God is God.)
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#34
(06-16-2018, 06:24 PM)Melkite Wrote:
(06-16-2018, 04:25 PM)Dominicus Wrote: By rising to regular life I mean that they enjoy perfect natural happiness, only lacking the supernatural life and happiness which cone from sanctifying grace.

Other than that I can't really say why God keeps all humans alive.

I imagine the latter can't be known without a specific revelation.  I don't think there is anything in nature that could lead man's reason to devise why God made that choice.

If regular life is enjoying perfect natural happiness, I have a hard time understanding that as a part of hell.  Is Limbo defined as a part of hell?  Do any theologians make a reasonable argument that it could be a separate place of its own?

Hell is where all those who are not in sanctifying grace go but there is more than one "part" of Hell. What you and I typically think of as "Hell" is actually the Hell of the damned also known as Tartarus or Gehenna. The word "Limbo" actually means "border" or "edge". There are two Limbos; the limbo of the patriarchs aka "Abrahams bosom" where all the just went before Christ and where we proclaim Christ descended after his death, and the limbo of the infants where the unbaptized innocent go. 

All of these together may be referred to as Hades or Sheol. Hades, in Greek myth referred to not only to a place of punishment but also to a place of paradise called Elysium.

The existence of the limbo of the patriarchs is undeniable as it is mentioned in the Bible and in the apostles creed at the very least. The limbo of the infants however is the product of an educated guess and can not really be known conclusively but at the same time should not be tossed aside.

It must be understood that its difficult to describe Hell as a physical place. While it very well may be a place the truth is we don't have any clue and its only certain that it is indeed a state of being and the people there will be reunited with their bodies.
Surréxit Dóminus vere, Alleluia!
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