Questions About Catholicism
#11
(06-21-2018, 08:55 PM)Justin Alphonsus Wrote: Plain and simple a Catholic is bound to believe everything contained in Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition.  They are summed up in the Four Creeds, which every Catholic must believe.  Yes, I did just crudely copy and paste.

The Athanasian Creed  
Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the Catholic [Apostolic/Universal] Faith, which except everyone shall have kept whole and undefiled, without doubt he will perish eternally.  Now the Catholic Faith is this: We worship One God in Trinity and Trinity in Unity, neither confounding the Persons nor dividing the substance.  For there is one Person of the Father, another of the Son, another of the Holy Spirit. But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, is One, the Glory equal, the Majesty coeternal.  Such as the Father is, such is the Son, and such is the Holy Spirit; the Father uncreated, the Son uncreated, and the Holy Spirit uncreated; the Father infinite, the Son infinite, and the Holy Spirit infinite; the Father eternal, the Son eternal, and the Holy Spirit eternal. And yet not three eternals but one eternal, as also not three infinites, nor three uncreated, but one uncreated, and one infinite. So, likewise, the Father is almighty, the Son almighty, and the Holy Spirit almighty; and yet not three almighties but one almighty.  So the Father is God, the Son God, and the Holy Spirit God; and yet not three Gods but one God. So the Father is Lord, the Son Lord, and the Holy Spirit Lord; and yet not three Lords but one Lord. For like as we are compelled by Christian truth to acknowledge every Person by Himself to be both God and Lord; so are we forbidden by the Catholic religion to say, there be three Gods or three Lords.  The Father is made of none, neither created nor begotten. The Son is of the Father alone, not made nor created but begotten. The Holy Spirit is of the Father and the Son, not made nor created nor begotten but proceeding. So there is one Father not three Fathers, one Son not three Sons, and Holy Spirit not three Holy Spirits. And in this Trinity there is nothing before or after, nothing greater or less, but the whole three Persons are coeternal together and coequal.  So that in all things, as is aforesaid, the Trinity in Unity and the Unity in Trinity is to be worshipped. He therefore who wills to be in a state of salvation, let him think thus of the Trinity.  But it is necessary to eternal salvation that he also believe faithfully the Incarnation of our Lord Jesus Christ. The right faith therefore is that we believe and confess that our Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is God and Man.  He is God of the substance of the Father begotten before the worlds, and He is man of the substance of His mother born in the world; perfect God, perfect man subsisting of a reasoning soul and human flesh; equal to the Father as touching His Godhead, inferior to the Father as touching His Manhood.  Who although He be God and Man yet He is not two but one Christ; one however not by conversion of the Godhead in the flesh, but by taking of the Manhood in God; one altogether not by confusion of substance but by unity of Person. For as the reasoning soul and flesh is one man, so God and Man is one Christ.  Who suffered for our salvation, descended into hell, rose again from the dead, ascended into heaven, sits at the right hand of the Father, from whence He shall come to judge the living and the dead. At whose coming all men shall rise again with their bodies and shall give account for their own works. And they that have done good shall go into life eternal, and they who indeed have done evil into eternal fire.  This is the Catholic faith, which except a man shall have believed faithfully and firmly he cannot be in a state of salvation.

The Apostle's Creed
I believe in God the Father Almighty, Creator of Heaven and earth, and in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord.  Who was conceived by the Holy Spirit, born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried. He descended into Hell;  the third day He arose again from the dead;  He ascended into Heaven and is seated at the right hand of God the Father Almighty, from thence He shall come to judge the living and the dead.  I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Holy Catholic Church, the Communion of Saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body, and life everlasting.  Amen. 
 
The Nicene Creed
 I believe in one God, the Father Almighty, 
maker of Heaven and earth and of all things 
visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus 
Christ, the only begotten Son of God, begotten 
of his Father before all ages, God of God, 
Light of Light, true God of true God, begotten, 
not made, consubstantial with the 
Father, by Whom all things were made; Who 
for us men and for our salvation, came down 
from Heaven, and was Incarnate by the Holy 
Spirit of the Virgin Mary and was made Man; 
He was crucified also for us under Pontius 
Pilate, and was buried. And the 
third day He rose again according to the 
Scriptures, and ascended into Heaven. He 
sitteth at the right hand of the Father: and He shall 
come again with glory to judge the living 
and the dead: and His kingdom shall have no end. 
And in the Holy Ghost, the Lord and 
Giver of life, Who proceedeth from the Father and 
the Son, Who, together with the Father and the Son, 
is adored and glorified: Who spoke by the 
prophets. And I believe in one holy Catholic and 
apostolic Church. I confess one Baptism 
for the remission of sins. And I expect the resurrection 
of the dead, and the life of the world to come. 
Amen.

I, N, with a firm faith believe and profess each and everything which is contained in the Creed which the Holy Roman Church maketh use of. To wit: (Then is said the Nicene Creed)  The Apostolic and Ecclesiastical traditions and all other observances and constitutions of that same Church I firmly admit to and embrace.
I also accept the Holy Scripture according to that sense which holy mother the Church hath held, and doth hold, and to whom it belongeth to judge the true sense and interpretations of the Scriptures. Neither will I ever take and interpret them otherwise than according to the unanimous consent of the Fathers.
I also profess that there are truly and properly Seven Sacraments of the New Law, instituted by Jesus Christ our Lord, and necessary for the salvation of mankind, though not all are necessary for everyone; to wit, Baptism, Confirmation, Eucharist, Penance, Extreme Unction, Holy Orders, and Matrimony; and that they confer grace; and that of these, Baptism, Confirmation, and Holy Orders cannot be repeated without sacrilege. I also receive and admit the accepted and approved ceremonies of the Catholic Church in the solemn administration of the aforesaid sacraments.
I embrace and accept each and everything which has been defined and declared in the holy Council of Trent concerning original sin and justification.
I profess, likewise, that in the Mass there is offered to God a true, proper, and propitiatory sacrifice for the living and the dead; and that in the most holy sacrament of the Eucharist there is truly, really, and substantially, the Body and Blood, together with the soul and divinity, of our Lord Jesus Christ; and that a conversion takes place of the whole substance of the bread into the Body, and of the whole substance of the wine into the Blood, which conversion the Catholic Church calls Transubstantiation. I also confess that under either species alone Christ is received whole and entire, and a true sacrament.
I steadfastly hold that there is a Purgatory, and that the souls therein detained are helped by the suffrages of the faithful. Likewise, that the saints, reigning together with Christ, are to be honored and invoked, and that they offer prayers to God for us, and that their relics are to be venerated. I most firmly assert that the images of Christ, of the Mother of God, ever virgin, and also of other Saints, ought to be kept and retained, and that due honor and veneration is to be given them.
I also affirm that the power of indulgences was left by Christ in the Church, and that the use of them is most wholesome to Christian people.  I acknowledge the Holy Catholic Apostolic Roman Church as the mother and teacher of all churches; and I promise true obedience to the Bishop of Rome, successor to St. Peter, Prince of the Apostles, and Vicar of Jesus Christ.
I likewise undoubtedly receive and profess all other things delivered, defined, and declared by the sacred Canons, and general Councils, and particularly by the holy Council of Trent, and by the ecumenical Council of the Vatican, particularly concerning the primacy of the Roman Pontiff and his infallible teaching. I condemn, reject, and anathematize all things contrary thereto, and all heresies which the Church hath condemned, rejected, and anathematized.
This true Catholic faith, outside of which no one can be saved, which I now freely profess and to which I truly adhere, I do so profess and swear to maintain inviolate and with firm constancy with the help of God until the last breath of life. And I shall strive, as far as possible, that this same faith shall be held, taught, and professed by all those over whom I have charge. I N. do so pledge, promise, and swear, so help me God and these Holy Gospels of God.


Thanks I will have a look. But is that all, is their not more?
“Its been said that when human beings stop believing in god they believe in nothing. The truth is much worse, they believe in anything.” 
Malcolm maggeridge
Reply
#12
(06-22-2018, 02:43 AM)Poche Wrote: I would suggest that you take the time to study the Nicene Creed that we say at mass on Sunday. Read it slowly and meditate on what you are reading.

I have done so but that alone did not fill the ccc.
“Its been said that when human beings stop believing in god they believe in nothing. The truth is much worse, they believe in anything.” 
Malcolm maggeridge
Reply
#13
(06-22-2018, 09:28 PM)1stvermont2ndvermont3rdvermont Wrote:
(06-21-2018, 07:35 PM)Dominicus Wrote: Try reading the Baltimore catechism, it's much shorter, simpler, and easier to digest. It explains the basics which all catholics must know without watering it down or overcomplicating things.

While the CCC is good, it is ultimately a reference work aimed at priests and such. Also it is heavily influenced by VII and thus skips around certain areas of the faith.

The issue of infallibility is a particularly complicated area and has many different levels, for example we believe the Bible is infallible on matters of faith and morals, the pope can make infallible pronouncements when speaking ex cathedra, ecumenical councils acting in his name can do likewise within certain limits. 

Are there any specific questions you have? Someone here can certainly help.

Great I found it free online

https://www.catholicity.com/baltimore-catechism/

Would you say than that everything in it is official catholic theology?



Nothing specific, just want to know.
 
Yes, the Baltimore catechism is orthodox and was approved for Catholic schools in the US for over a century. Where everybody is getting confused is they are finding the CCC has several differences compared to all other catechisms that came before it. Looking at how the faith must be handed down unchanged, this fact cannot be ignored and is a major stumbling block for converts, and existing Catholics as well. The changes came in through the Second Vatican Council and you will need to decide how to react to that problem:
  • The sedevacantists say the Council was illegitimate and therefore changes were null and void
  • SSPX say the Council was valid, but they resist the changes
  • The local dioceses say the changes were fine
It's a problem every Catholic is facing right now.
[-] The following 1 user Likes pabbie's post:
  • 1stvermont2ndvermont3rdvermont
Reply
#14
(06-22-2018, 10:13 PM)pabbie Wrote:
(06-22-2018, 09:28 PM)1stvermont2ndvermont3rdvermont Wrote:
(06-21-2018, 07:35 PM)Dominicus Wrote: Try reading the Baltimore catechism, it's much shorter, simpler, and easier to digest. It explains the basics which all catholics must know without watering it down or overcomplicating things.

While the CCC is good, it is ultimately a reference work aimed at priests and such. Also it is heavily influenced by VII and thus skips around certain areas of the faith.

The issue of infallibility is a particularly complicated area and has many different levels, for example we believe the Bible is infallible on matters of faith and morals, the pope can make infallible pronouncements when speaking ex cathedra, ecumenical councils acting in his name can do likewise within certain limits. 

Are there any specific questions you have? Someone here can certainly help.

Great I found it free online

https://www.catholicity.com/baltimore-catechism/

Would you say than that everything in it is official catholic theology?



Nothing specific, just want to know.
 
Yes, the Baltimore catechism is orthodox and was approved for Catholic schools in the US for over a century. Where everybody is getting confused is they are finding the CCC has several differences compared to all other catechisms that came before it. Looking at how the faith must be handed down unchanged, this fact cannot be ignored and is a major stumbling block for converts, and existing Catholics as well. The changes came in through the Second Vatican Council and you will need to decide how to react to that problem:
  • The sedevacantists say the Council was illegitimate and therefore changes were null and void
  • SSPX say the Council was valid, but they resist the changes
  • The local dioceses say the changes were fine
It's a problem every Catholic is facing right now.


Thanks for the help.
“Its been said that when human beings stop believing in god they believe in nothing. The truth is much worse, they believe in anything.” 
Malcolm maggeridge
Reply




Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)