Restaurant Etiquette for Traditional Catholics
#21
(07-11-2018, 10:44 PM)For Petes Sake Wrote: Can someone explain "invalids" to me.

Somebody with a disability, injury, or illness. Often pejorative. Sometimes meaning someone who is homebound or hospitalized or who needs caring for.

Pronounced in-VUH-lid, not as in-VAL-id.
Surréxit Dóminus vere, Alleluia!
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#22
Wait, I just figured it out. Mark Williams is Sacha Baron Cohen. You're trolling us. Very nice!
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#23
(07-11-2018, 06:59 PM)Dominicus Wrote: I always tip at least 20%. You never know if your servers just having a bad day, no reason to make it worse.

While I agree, that's no reason to take it out on your customers. If the server is just not being super happy, cheery, or whatever, I don't care. I'm from New York, I'm used to people being generally miserable. I don't expect a lot in terms of being nice. However, unwarranted sarcasm, eye rolls, and general meanness shouldn't be tolerated. It's rare that I come across those things anyway. 

What I get annoyed about is a server who just doesn't seem to be on top of things. They take your drink order, drinks come 10+ minutes later. They drop off your drinks and don't even ask you if you want to order food. Your food is taking a really long time to come out and they don't check in the kitchen and give you an update. You never get refills of your water without having to ask. When you're clearly done with your meal, they don't come to ask you if you want dessert/check and are either nowhere to be found or just bs'ing with their coworkers. These are the simple, fundamental things that 99% of servers get right. I get it if it's really busy and if I see the server running around going crazy with other customers I won't complain, but occasionally I come across servers who are just downright incompetent or seem like they just don't care about doing the most basic stuff. I came across a server like this a few days ago when I was out with a couple friends. We still tipped like 17% and mostly because at least she was nice. I don't ask for much, but just do your job and I'll tip you well. 

On a side note, statistics show that millennial are the worst tippers. Go figure.
Blood of Christ, relief of the burdened, save us.

“It is my design to die in the brew house; let ale be placed in my mouth when I am expiring, that when the choirs of angels come, they may say, “Be God propitious to this drinker.” – St. Columbanus, A.D. 612

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#24
(07-12-2018, 09:36 AM)Bourbon Apocalypse Wrote: Wait, I just figured it out. Mark Williams is Sacha Baron Cohen. You're trolling us. Very nice!

Interesting theory.  How'd you figure it out?  Did he poop in a bag?

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I want creation to penetrate you with so much admiration that wherever you go, the least plant may bring you clear remembrance of the Creator.  A single plant, a blade of grass, or one speck of dust is sufficient to occupy all your intelligence in beholding the art with which it has been made  - Saint Basil

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#25
I agree with some points in the article, but not the premise.  I am wholly anti-etiquette. 

The basis of catholic behavior is modesty and that suffices. 

I refuse to bow to victorian notions of etiquette that plague post-protestant countries like Canada and the USA.

Example: screaming baby in restaurant (ignored or allowed by parents) = an immodesty
Example: elbows on table = a liberty

Example: mountain ranges of bare cleavage = an immodesty
Example: getting a meal at Denny's because you work 2nd shift = a liberty

I don't care if someone chews with his mouth open, has elbows on the table, etc., even though I have physical aversions to some of that.  Those are not sins.  They may be imperfections, but in the face of a man sitting at table with his arm around a woman who came out dressed only in her under-slip, elbows on the table is a non-existent concern.

Immodest folks should be shunned.  Uncouth folks should be ignored.  One is immoral, the other is imperfect.

That said, I despise restaurants.  Hosts/esses, wait staff and cooks are generally incompetent and magnify unpleasant situations caused by other patrons.
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#26
(07-11-2018, 09:26 PM)GangGreen Wrote: In Italy (and I think in Europe in general), service is either built into the price or added for each person served... usually a couple euros each. In the US restaurants would rather keep the prices a bit lower and pay their employees less and have the customers make up the rest. I'm sure there's a financial reason behind it. Although theoretically a server can make way more money on tips than a flat wage. A busy night can see them take home hundreds.

It really depends on the restaurant. I used to be a waitress, and at the first place I worked, it was a way to keep a low revenue restaurant afloat at the expense of the staff. I barely made minimum wage with my base pay and tips together, sometimes less, even on a somewhat busy night. I didn’t even get to keep all the tips that I made. They called it tipsharing- the hostesses and most kitchen staff were also paid much less than minimum wage, and they took a percentage of our tips to make up the difference. Tipsharing is pretty widespread in US restaurants, even the nice ones. Basically, the customers pay the employees to work there, with a little on top from the restaurant. Even an army of teenage babysitters would be more expensive than an army of waitstaff for a restaurant to employ. Saves them a lot of money. I think current tipping recommendations (18-20%) were calculated at what it would take for the average waitstaff to take home minimum wage at the average restaurant on an average night.

The second restaurant was much nicer, and I made much better tips. However, it was rare for me to bring home much more than $100 in a night unless I worked in the bar that night or it was a holiday and patrons were extra generous. I think you’d have to work in a restaurant where the average item price was $30 to start making hundreds per night in tips.

I’m just happy I have my bachelor’s degree and professional registries now and can make MUCH more money even just working part time.
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#27
(07-11-2018, 02:41 PM)Dominicus Wrote: Traditionalism does not equate to neo-victorianism. Marks been reading too much Tradition In Action, that sites full of this.

Manners and such are important but holding a fork wrongly does not make me a barbarian. Also these folk dont seem to get that manners and customs do change over time, its not all a result of the Revolution.

TIA is definitely over the top with its Victorian vibe and that is a turn-off.  It's too bad because it has good quick reads for exposing the heresy brought on by VII and the post-VII pontiffs.

Unfortunately, it is Christian society which developed manners as an outward sign of charity for others and as Christian society devolves, individuals become more self-absorbed, and diabolical disorientation takes over, manners will devolve as well.

 In Victorian times, however, manners were all too often used as a source of pride and class distinction which distorted the intention from charity to self-importance.

When we are in a position to truly begin rebuilding Christian culture, manners will be a reflection of the knowledge, grace and virtue citizens acquire through Catechesis and the Sacraments.

In the meantime, we are going to be called upon to grow in the virtue of patience with folks who weren't raised with any knowledge of God, manners, family, discipline or self-control.  There but for the grace of God go we.  

Thoughts such as, "Isn't it nice to see a large group of family and friends enjoying time together and getting along instead of home alone with their electronic devices," will go a long way in helping our attitude.  

A restaurant isn't a library and snooty articles don't convert people.
Rome will lose the faith and become the seat of the antichrist. 
The demons of the air together with the Antichrist will perform great wonders  
The Church will be in eclipse

-Our Lady of La Salette


Like Christ, His Bride the Church will undergo its own passion, burial, and resurrection.
-unknown traditional priest

Father Ripperger said that if we are detached from all things, aren't afraid to suffer, and we accept all suffering as the will of God for our sanctity, we have nothing to fear!
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#28
(07-12-2018, 12:57 PM)Catherine Wrote: The second restaurant was much nicer, and I made much better tips. However, it was rare for me to bring home much more than $100 in a night unless I worked in the bar that night or it was a holiday and patrons were extra generous. I think you’d have to work in a restaurant where the average item price was $30 to start making hundreds per night in tips.

I guess it all depends where you live and how busy the restaurant is. I never worked in a restaurant, but have good friends who did. Sometimes they would talk about how an average night wouldn't be the best, but the weekends they'd easily be taking home a few hundred, especially if they got lucky with a big party. Talking about a run of the mill, not fancy Italian restaurant. I have a restaurant near me, Italian place again average priced nothing crazy, we went last night on a Wednesday expecting the place to be dead, it was packed. I'm like, don't people cook anymore? Get into a place like that, and I'm sure an average night you're taking home a nice chunk of cash.
Blood of Christ, relief of the burdened, save us.

“It is my design to die in the brew house; let ale be placed in my mouth when I am expiring, that when the choirs of angels come, they may say, “Be God propitious to this drinker.” – St. Columbanus, A.D. 612

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#29
I mean, etiquette is etiquette. Table etiquette is something that people learn to do so that they don't look like an uncivilized slob at the dinner table. However, if someone doesn't follow that etiquette, well if they're your family member feel free to correct them I guess. If they're someone else, shut your mouth and mind your own business. Either way, someone can chew with their mouths open, put their elbows on the table, feet up, whatever and it's not sinful. The only way I can see it being sinful is if someone told you it was impolite (especially for wherever you're eating) and you do it even more to annoy them or start a selfish argument over it to "Do what I want!"
Blood of Christ, relief of the burdened, save us.

“It is my design to die in the brew house; let ale be placed in my mouth when I am expiring, that when the choirs of angels come, they may say, “Be God propitious to this drinker.” – St. Columbanus, A.D. 612

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#30
(07-12-2018, 12:57 PM)Catherine Wrote: Basically, the customers pay the employees to work there, with a little on top from the restaurant. 

Forty five years ago there was a very nice sit down Italian restaurant in Kansas City. It was inside the old streetcar barn, and there was an actual streetcar in the centre with tables in it. On each table was a counterweighted flag. If you wanted a waiter, you tipped the flag up, and bingo! Your waiter appeared.

They actually did not pay their waiters. Oh, on paper they did, reporting minimum wage for tax purposes, but in reality, all the serving staff made was tips. However, there was always a waiting list of guys who wanted to work there because the tips were so good. 

And, if you've read Orwell's Down and Out in Paris and London'there were actually restaurants in Paris where the waiters paid the patron for their job!
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