Church Militant : a purveyor of detraction and slander?
#71
When a person casually presumes to treat lightly one of the cornerstones of Western justice and law, namely, the assumption of innocence until guilt is proven, a concept so pivotal and reflected upon since the time of the Greeks and Romans, perfected by Divine Revelation and the wisdom of Saints and Doctors, because in their random opinion a case "rings true," whatever that means and whatever epistemological weight that supposedly claims to carry, yes, I think Magister is perfectly right to call you, Eliza, out on your rashness and shame you. And I think others ought to do so as well. You ought to feel ashamed to think you know better than thousands of years of literally torturous reflection and experience on justice and due process. You know, the sort of thing that allowed the Son of God to so easily be crucified by a raging mob. 

Maybe Fr. McLucas is guilty. Maybe not. Except we have access to no hard evidence, and it's not our place to make calls of peoples' guilt or innocence anyway. And by the way, all of that has nothing to do with the SSPX, the ICK, the FSSP, the CMRI, or any Traditionalist group. Should be obvious, but apparently isn't.

This is precisely the sort of ham-handed, mob-like, emotion-driven reactionism that destroys the foundations of a moral society. It's the tactics of radical leftists, which Magister rightly pointed out CM has been employing certainly in this case, and that's regardless of whatever intentions they may have had. Scandal and the destruction of a reputation can come about despite a person's perfectly good intentions. It could come about because of their plain stupidity or inability to shut their mouths at the right time. 

Let's side with the victims. Let's compromise these seemingly arbitrary and harsh principles for a case that "rings true." Let's let go of those old ways of doing things because...I just feel like it. It always sounds good because it always involves some form of virtue signaling. Who isn't for victims? Who isn't compassionate on the poor? But that's not the point. 

How many people does it take who feel like a case like this doesn't "ring true" before you consider you might better employ your energy on something other than wasting so many words in defense of a situation, a person, or an organization you don't really know anything about?

But this is the point of being a traditionalist, or for those who shudder at the label, the point of being a conservative. You hesitate. You stop and reflect and ask, "What is going on here?" before you grab the pitchfork and torch. You show some level of healthy skepticism at your own motives and have the humility to admit how strong the temptation for "justice" may appear, even if that justice is a complete parody of moral goodness. We uphold traditions because, you know, they actually contain some seed of wisdom that we should consider even if that's not immediately evident to our enlightened, 21st century sensibilities.

[/soap box]
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#72
(08-02-2019, 12:51 AM)piscis Wrote: [/soap box]

Well, it's a soap box.

That is crazy. It is not a sin to have thoughts about what seems right and what seems wrong. I am not a jailer. My having the opinion is not going to put McLucas in jail. Do you think I should go to jail for having an opinion?

God gave us two sides of our brain for a reason. Intuition and feelings are actually not a sin to use, not according to the catechism or the Bible. God gives this to people in different measures. To some more, others less. He doesn't tell us not to use it. My intuition as well as knowledge in this area applied to the available info makes a plausible case for his guilt and I can't think of a plausible case for his innocence and neither can anyone else here. 

I think your condemnation of me is hasty and not well thought out.


Do you think the Carmelite other Superior who got rid of McLucas because she judged him guilty was wrong, because no court of law was involved in her judgment?
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#73
Paul says "find a point of agreement with people" but you missed that one when you read your Bible I guess. You take all my efforts to explain my thought and all of my efforts to understand what others are saying, and you find NOTHING to agree with. . All you see is an opportunity to get out your soap box and use REALLY UGLY WORDS and diatribes to judge me. I'm sure you feel GREAT now. I don't.
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#74
Thank you, unknown forum reader, who traveled here to let me know that someone found something to be thankful for in what I made so much effort to say, after much effort to understand. It comforts that it was not a complete waste of time, because I very much regret the time I wasted on this thread. My sense of justice has been offended. But I did learn a lesson. Also I am grateful for this thread, as because of it, my heart has expanded to include McLucas' [alleged] victim, and also Mary Rose Maher.
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#75
After people have responded to them, please don't edit posts in any way that'd affect any arguments made or rhetoric used.
T h e   D u d e t t e   A b i d e s
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#76
(08-05-2019, 12:55 AM)St.Eliza Wrote: Thank you, unknown forum reader, who traveled here to let me know that someone found something to be thankful for in what I made so much effort to say, after much effort to understand. It comforts that it was not a complete waste of time, because I very much regret the time I wasted on this thread. My sense of justice has been offended. But I did learn a lesson. Also I am grateful for this thread, as because of it, my heart has expanded to include McLucas' [alleged] victim, and also Mary Rose Maher.

You're welcome.  I'm very surprised that I'm the only one.
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