The Latin Mass becomes a cult of toxic tradition
#11
"much needed reform".
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Name one much needed reform.  Just one. 
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I'll wait.
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#12
"For example, the color red was forbidden to be worn in the church"

Anyone know where they got this from?
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#13
(11-05-2019, 10:23 PM)Florus Wrote: "For example, the color red was forbidden to be worn in the church"

Anyone know where they got this from?

Sounds like from the veiling conversation reported (methinks Joe Biden put on a cassock), she just was around some very bizarre independent chapels, not "the Latin Mass".

I've seen some pretty crazy folks in my day, some who follow very weird apparitions, are more concerned with making sure they have uber-pure fresh blessed beeswax candles for the supposed "Three Days Darkness" than with good spiritual reading or a prayer vigil at the abortion clinic. I've not seen this at any legitimate church at which the Latin Mass is celebrated, certainly not at any SSPX, FSSP, ICK, etc. church. At the "resistance", Sedevacantist and independent places, more likely, but even there, what she describes is just weird stuff, not mainstream, yet she tries to generalize it to every place where the Traditional Mass is celebrated.

If an FSSP or SSPX priest (or any priest with a superior) ever tried to forbid red, impose lifetime penances, or tell a teenage girl that she has really pretty hair and she'd look really nice in a very long veil, I have a feeling he'd not be doing much public ministry ever again.
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#14
The article was uncharitable in certain areas, especially with name-calling "cultists," etc., which is ironic because the author also rails against hypocrisy. It comes across as a very exaggerated, as if the person attended Latin Masses populated by the most stereotypical caricatures of Traditionalists while simultaneously casting them as Pharisaical villains. It would be like someone visiting a university fraternity house on a Saturday night and coming away with the belief that the entire college experience consisted of ridiculous parties.

On the other hand, parts of it should ring as warnings for Traditionalists to *not become* stereotypes obsessed solely with aesthetics, or so consumed by private revelations that their devotion to them takes precedence over the Gospel.
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#15
(11-05-2019, 11:29 PM)LionHippo Wrote: On the other hand, parts of it should ring as warnings for Traditionalists to *not become* stereotypes obsessed solely with aesthetics, or so consumed by private revelations that their devotion to them takes precedence over the Gospel.

I agree, but the thing is that this applies to every Catholic, whatever their theological/liturgical leanings. The generalizations are too vague when applied to any group to speak usefully about them. We could look at the myriad "aesthetic" varieties within the Novus Ordo (charismatic, Latin, praise and worship, ethnic diversity) and devotions based on private revelations there (e.g. Fatima, Divine Mercy, Medjugorje) and level a similar criticism, yet this would still be uncharitable insofar as the reality is always more complicated than that. We have to address individuals as individuals, not as instances of cookie cut zombies. People in any group will always carry their own idiosyncrasies that fall short of the ideal or at least obscure it.
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#16
IMHO - Sounds like Miss Fletcher may have a twitter eye view of the world. Of course her article dovetails nicely when the Pope new prayer intention. Politics...
Oh, where are the snows of yesteryear!
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#17
(11-05-2019, 11:29 PM)LionHippo Wrote: It would be like someone visiting a university fraternity house on a Saturday night and coming away with the belief that the entire college experience consisted of ridiculous parties.

It doesn't?

Sounds like news to the U.S. Senate.
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#18
(11-06-2019, 12:35 AM)Blind Horus Wrote: IMHO - Sounds like Miss Fletcher may have a twitter eye view of the world. Of course her article dovetails nicely when the Pope new prayer intention. Politics...

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#19
Quote:“The people had the humor of a gallows crowd and the pastor, arrayed in lavish vestments, was more like a Renaissance baron.” 

- I was always under the impression that people were rowdy at public executions back in the day.  I hope the people at the Mass she attended understood they weren’t witnessing the execution of a common criminal, but the Sacrifice of Jesus Christ, the Son of the Living God.  


Quote:“It is very unfortunate that younger generations of Catholics seeking to deepen their faith are getting sucked into this vortex of toxic, traditional radicalism. I saw many young families at a Latin Mass recently when I was invited to attend a speaking engagement at a traditional church…...Looking around, I was astonished to see many college-aged men and women among the crowd. The priests seemed to be in their 30s. Clearly these people were too young to remember times before Vatican II. Yet something had drawn them here. Parental influence? Doubtful. It seemed to be a shared spirit of ultra-conservatism. I found it frightening to reflect on how the closed, Latin Mass mindset had managed to replicate itself over time and spread like a virus.”


-I wonder if she has asked any of these young Catholics why they find the traditional faith more appealing.  It seems like a great opportunity for dialogue.   I hope she is not closed up in her own mind, saying to herself, “I have seen this type of person before, there is nothing more to know” and projecting personalities onto them because of her negative experiences from the past.  No!  Encounter is the way to go.


Quote:“Unsurprisingly, while there I had another memorably bad experience. I asked to receive Communion in the hands. Most traditional-type priests I'd encountered in my lifetime would give me the Eucharist in the hands. Not this pastor. He literally made a scene at the altar and jerked the Eucharist away from me when I reached out to receive it — as if my hands would contaminate the very Jesus who, according to the Catholic faith, seeks Communion with my soul. I seriously considered walking out of the church at that point, but decided to receive the Eucharist instead since I wanted to pray.”

  • It is a shame she is so rigid with regard to how she believes she should receive Communion.   It would have given her peace to remember Saint Ambrose's words to Saint Augustine, “When in Rome, live as the Romans do; when elsewhere, live as they live elsewhere.”

Quote:“I reminded him that, as a priest, he was supposed to be of service and value my feedback as a believer.”



-I SAID I DIDN'T WANT ANY MAYONNAISE ON MY SANDWICH!  I PAY YOUR SALARY YOU IDIOT!!!
My word choices are based on sound, not meaning.

Yes, that defeats the purpose of language.
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#20
(11-06-2019, 01:24 AM)MagisterMusicae Wrote:
(11-06-2019, 12:35 AM)Blind Horus Wrote: IMHO - Sounds like Miss Fletcher may have a twitter eye view of the world. Of course her article dovetails nicely when the Pope new prayer intention. Politics...

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Hmm, clever
Oh, where are the snows of yesteryear!
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