The Utter Insanity of Fundamentalism
#1
From KFOR

Spell says if anyone in his congregation contracts COVID-19, he will heal them through God.

“I’m going to address that by laying hands on them and praying for them and depending on God to heal their body,” Spell said.


Louisiana church hosts more than 1,800 people amid COVID-19 outbreak
Jovan-Marya of the Immaculate Conception Weismiller, T.O.Carm.

Vive le Christ-roi! Vive le roi, Louis XX!
Deum timete, regem honorificate.
Kansan by birth! Albertan by choice! Jayhawk by the Grace of God!
  “Qui me amat, amet et canem meum. (Who loves me will love my dog also.)” 
St Bernard of Clairvaux

My Blog 'Musings of an Old Curmudgeon'


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#2
Their faith is commendable, but vain. God help them.   :(
"The Heart of Jesus is closer to you when you suffer, than when you are full of joy." - St. Margaret Mary Alacoque

"modern Catholics have tended to put too much faith in the pope and too little in the Church." - Bishop Williamson.

"And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul; but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell." - Mt. 10:28
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#3
Indeed, the Eucharist is not magic. It heals body and soul but if taken vainly, it will lead to death. Viruses get around a multitude of ways too. Even through the air around the Eucharist as it is being received. I'm still shocked that my Eparchy continues to provide the Holy Communion even though people die from this virus. Fairfax is hit even worse than we are and that's as our own county's number spiked upwards of 8 yesterday!
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#4
Ah yes, Satan's second direct sin against Our Savior after His fast in the desert:

Mat 4: 7 Jesus said to him, But it is further written, Thou shalt not put the Lord thy God to the proof.

The Protestants love to do just this thing and some Catholic Novis Ordo 'pentacostal' types as well.

Sad thing, indeed!
One should have an open mind; open enough that things get in, but not so open that everything falls out
Art Bell
  
I don't need a good memory, because I always tell the truth.
Jessie Ventura

Its no wonder truth is stranger than fiction.
Fiction has to make sense
Mark Twain

If history doesn't repeat itself, it sure does rhyme.
Mark Twain

You don't have a soul. You are a soul. You have a body.
C.S. Lewis
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#5
(03-27-2020, 02:05 PM)Zedt Wrote: The Protestants love to do just this thing and some Catholic Novis Ordo 'pentacostal' types as well.
Not just the fundamentalists. This Mar 8th contamination is from an Episcopal parish in D.C. Cautionary tale.

"A priest who spent several days shaking the hands of hundreds of worshippers in a US church has tested positive for coronavirus.

Reverend Timothy Cole, in his late 50s, led three services last Sunday at Christ Church Georgetown, which were attended by 550 people. Mr Cole, who has been with the church since 2016, identified himself as the infected priest in a statement to his congregation."
The deeds you do may be the only sermon some people may hear today (Francis of Assisi); Win an argument, lose a soul (Fulton Sheen)
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#6
There is a difference, however, between the stupidity shown by Mr Cole, and the insanity of Spell saying that if anyone gets sick from the gathering, it's OK because he will 'lay... hands on them and pray... for them and depend... on God to heal their body'. Having been an Anglican, I can't imagine any Anglican clergyman saying something like that.

As Z pointed out,

Quote:Ah yes, Satan's second direct sin against Our Savior after His fast in the desert:


Mat 4: 7 Jesus said to him, But it is further written, Thou shalt not put the Lord thy God to the proof.
Jovan-Marya of the Immaculate Conception Weismiller, T.O.Carm.

Vive le Christ-roi! Vive le roi, Louis XX!
Deum timete, regem honorificate.
Kansan by birth! Albertan by choice! Jayhawk by the Grace of God!
  “Qui me amat, amet et canem meum. (Who loves me will love my dog also.)” 
St Bernard of Clairvaux

My Blog 'Musings of an Old Curmudgeon'


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#7
Arg! Reminds me of when my dearly departed sister-in-law was dying of a brain tumor, and her born-again (or WHATEVER) “pastor” & his wife kept “believing God to heal her” OR if she did die, believing he would be able to “resurrect” her by laying hands on her and “believing”! That deprived my nieces and nephews of beginning the grieving process & using the time they had to properly say their good-byes. They believed it would have been a “lack of faith” to admit that she was dying. Even at her weird “funeral service,” (?) the pastor kept blathering on about how he just did not understand WHY God didn’t heal/resurrect my sis-in-law.. what a number that must’ve done on her children’s hearts and minds — frankly it made me angry. But the guy was “sincerely deluded”/ possibly somewhat nuts. It amazes me how these folks stay so loyal to such an unsatisfactory belief system.
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#8
(03-27-2020, 09:14 PM)jovan66102 Wrote: There is a difference, however, between the stupidity shown by Mr Cole, and the insanity of Spell saying that if anyone gets sick from the gathering, it's OK because he will 'lay... hands on them and pray... for them and depend... on God to heal their body'. Having been an Anglican, I can't imagine any Anglican clergyman saying something like that.

As Z pointed out,

Quote:Ah yes, Satan's second direct sin against Our Savior after His fast in the desert:


Mat 4: 7 Jesus said to him, But it is further written, Thou shalt not put the Lord thy God to the proof.
Keep in mind Cole's infection happened before the orders to shutdown. Ironically, the first person in my city to be infected with the virus came from that service.
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#9
(03-28-2020, 08:17 PM)Margaret-Mary Wrote: Arg! Reminds me of when my dearly departed sister-in-law was dying of a brain tumor, and her born-again (or WHATEVER) “pastor” & his wife kept “believing God to heal her” OR if she did die, believing he would be able to “resurrect” her by laying hands on her and “believing”! That deprived my nieces and nephews of beginning the grieving process & using the time they had to properly say their good-byes. They believed it would have been a “lack of faith” to admit that she was dying. Even at her weird “funeral service,” (?) the pastor kept blathering on about how he just did not understand WHY God didn’t heal/resurrect my sis-in-law.. what a number that must’ve done on her children’s hearts and minds — frankly it made me angry. But the guy was “sincerely deluded”/ possibly somewhat nuts. It amazes me how these folks stay so loyal to such an unsatisfactory belief system.

As an Evangelical, I would distance myself from that kind of extreme. Most Evangelicals lean toward the “cessationist” camp to one degree or another. Cessationism is the belief that the Holy Spirit doesn’t manifest Himself the way He did in the days of the apostles. The manifest gifts of tongues and miraculous healings don’t always happen. That’s not to say they NEVER happen, it’s just that they are rare compared to the time of Jesus and His apostles. The HS may remain silent when we don’t want Him to but He is still present and at work in different ways. Despite the great advances of medical science people still die. Jesus raised Lazarus from the dead but Lazarus died again. Jesus’ point in this raising was to show that He is the resurrection and the life - not to declare death no longer occurs. Death may be swallowed up in victory but that is on His terms, not ours. Sadly, people forget that.
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#10
"Jesus raised Lazarus from the dead but Lazarus died again. Jesus’ point in this raising was to show that He is the resurrection and the life - not to declare death no longer occurs. Death may be swallowed up in victory but that is on His terms, not ours. Sadly, people forget that."


This topic intrigues me.  How does the above fit into Evangelical belief?

For instance, where does the idea that Lazarus died again come from, and how does the Evangelical reconcile that with Sacred Scripture?  

See Hebrews 9:27 (KJV):  "And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment..."

My understanding of Evangelicalism is that Evangelicals believe that, after death, a person goes either to Heaven or hell; they do not believe in a third state between those two (e.g., purgatory or limbo). 

Is that accurate?

If that is the case, what happened to people like Dorcas and Eutychus the moment they died?  According to Evangelical belief, when we die, we are judged, as the text from Hebrews makes plain, and then we end up in either Heaven or hell.

Is it possible to die, go to hell, resurrect, and then return to live on earth, die again, and then go to Heaven?

How about the opposite?

If there is no third place, did Dorcas go to Heaven and then return to earth and live?  How is that possible?

Worse is the opposite.  Did she go to hell and then come back?  How?

What part of the Bible gives an Evangelical the answers to such questions?

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