The Problem With Contemporary Churches
#1


I have watched a few of this gentleman's videos. The above one should, I hope, begin 4 mins 49 seconds in: "What I saw protestants doing was..."

Brian succinctly summarises what is wrong with modern Christianity, IMHO. With Novus Ordo, I believe Catholicism is not immune, either. That is why I want to attend a TLM.
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#2
Great summary, and that's why I have always found both ends of the Protestant spectrum unattractive. The traditionalists are too stripped down so as to have no appeal, almost bereft of the vital spiritual element needed for worship. The more contemporary sects have entirely jettisoned their Christian character and virtues in a race to embrace the modern world to see who could catch more converts.

Someone I talked to mentioned his admiration of how well Evangelicals have incorporated and appealed to the current culture and wished Catholics would follow suit. I just don't see this as a positive thing. Great - you helped some atheists and degenerates find God, but have they actually turned their lives around to follow the true Christ or just some watered-down, hippie-friendly version of Him? Unfortunately, as Brian suggests, you risk eventual implosion by adapting to the current climate, especially when it changes as rapidly as it does today.
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#3
(07-14-2020, 08:49 AM)Mourning Dove Wrote: I have always found both ends of the Protestant spectrum unattractive.  The traditionalists are too stripped down so as to have no appeal, almost bereft of the vital spiritual element needed for worship.  The more contemporary sects have entirely jettisoned their Christian character and virtues in a race to embrace the modern world to see who could catch more converts. 

Succinctly put. I totally agree.
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#4
(07-14-2020, 08:49 AM)Mourning Dove Wrote: Someone I talked to mentioned his admiration of how well Evangelicals have incorporated and appealed to the current culture and wished Catholics would follow suit.  I just don't see this as a positive thing.  Great - you helped some atheists and degenerates find God, but have they actually turned their lives around to follow the true Christ or just some watered-down, hippie-friendly version of Him?  Unfortunately, as Brian suggests, you risk eventual implosion by adapting to the current climate, especially when it changes as rapidly as it does today.

Evangelicalism is a special kind of evil hiding behind a Christian face. My soon-to-be brother-in-law is an Evangelical, but is willing to put his politics above the simple truths Christ taught in the Gospels, citing in particular a recent conversation where he claims to be "pro-life" but supports a woman's "right to choose." I attempted to explain to him that an evil act for good intentions is still an evil act, no matter how you paint it, but I think he just took that as my crazy "Catholic" opinion rather than a serious point.

Evangelicals like the warm and fuzzy 'feelies' that pretending to follow Christ brings you, but are unwilling to accept the hard teachings and calls to conversion that Christ expected. Not to say that many so-called Catholics follow suit either.

Not every one that saith to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven: but he that doth the will of my Father who is in heaven, he shall enter into the kingdom of heaven. - Matt. 7:21
"The Heart of Jesus is closer to you when you suffer, than when you are full of joy." - St. Margaret Mary Alacoque

Put not your trust in princes: In the children of men, in whom there is no salvation. - Ps. 145:2-3

"For there shall be a time, when they will not endure sound doctrine; but, according to their own desires, they will heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears: And will indeed turn away their hearing from the truth, but will be turned unto fables." - 2 Timothy 4:3-4
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#5
Quote:My soon-to-be brother-in-law is an Evangelical, but is willing to put his politics above the simple truths Christ taught in the Gospels, citing in particular a recent conversation where he claims to be "pro-life" but supports a woman's "right to choose."

Fence-sitting cognitive dissonance at its finest - that's the kind of argument I'd expect from an atheistic Moderate.  Why even purport to be Christian?  Sadly, I've heard some of the same reasoning from left-leaning Catholics.

If we really support a woman's rights, we are more inclined to prevent her from even finding herself in that situation to begin with.  

Quote:Evangelicals like the warm and fuzzy 'feelies' that pretending to follow Christ brings you, but are unwilling to accept the hard teachings and calls to conversion that Christ expected. Not to say that many so-called Catholics follow suit either.

That about sums it up!  Yes, God is love - but it's tough love, and that's not a bad thing since tough love builds character and protects us from evil forces.  These are the same people who point to our Lord associating with sinners (perhaps as an excuse to rationalize the sin they refuse to remediate?) but seem to forget the crucial second part to "sin no more."

I do wonder - without the sacrament of penance, what system do Prots have to recognize and self-correct sinful behavior?  Do they just keep repeating it and excuse themselves with "I'm a sinner"?
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#6
(07-16-2020, 09:01 AM)Mourning Dove Wrote: I do wonder - without the sacrament of penance, what system do Prots have to recognize and self-correct sinful behavior?  Do they just keep repeating it and excuse themselves with "I'm a sinner"?
They gave into psycobabble and started a movement called Biblical Counseling. I think it came out of the drug-fueled 70s and really took off in the 90s. You might be chosen to share your "testimony" in front of everybody like a celebrity roast, if you are trustworthy and your story is going to pull heartstrings. This reinforces the belief in the need for conversion experiences, instead of being able to say "I was born and raised in a Christian family" with a thankful heart. That isn't showy enough, that doesn't open wallets.

I have been to Baptist and Presbyterian churches where this was not the case, but those churches were outside the evangelical mainstream.
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#7
Well Protestants believe in the 'five solae'. Solus Christus, through Christ alone, is the belief that no earthly mediator is necessary and one can pray straight to Jesus/God for forgiveness.
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#8
(07-14-2020, 10:56 PM)Augustinian Wrote:
(07-14-2020, 08:49 AM)Mourning Dove Wrote: Someone I talked to mentioned his admiration of how well Evangelicals have incorporated and appealed to the current culture and wished Catholics would follow suit.  I just don't see this as a positive thing.  Great - you helped some atheists and degenerates find God, but have they actually turned their lives around to follow the true Christ or just some watered-down, hippie-friendly version of Him?  Unfortunately, as Brian suggests, you risk eventual implosion by adapting to the current climate, especially when it changes as rapidly as it does today.

Evangelicalism is a special kind of evil hiding behind a Christian face. My soon-to-be brother-in-law is an Evangelical, but is willing to put his politics above the simple truths Christ taught in the Gospels, citing in particular a recent conversation where he claims to be "pro-life" but supports a woman's "right to choose." I attempted to explain to him that an evil act for good intentions is still an evil act, no matter how you paint it, but I think he just took that as my crazy "Catholic" opinion rather than a serious point.

Evangelicals like the warm and fuzzy 'feelies' that pretending to follow Christ brings you, but are unwilling to accept the hard teachings and calls to conversion that Christ expected. Not to say that many so-called Catholics follow suit either.

Not every one that saith to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven: but he that doth the will of my Father who is in heaven, he shall enter into the kingdom of heaven. - Matt. 7:21

Why paint all Evangelicals with the same brush? We're not all the same. I know many who would take issue with your future brother-in-law. No one can be pro-life and pro-choice at the same time. I agree that the "feelies" have crept into the Evangelical Church but is it not the same with the Catholic Church? (I'm asking here). Many of us resist the "Positivity" gospel. Jesus was often negative. The truth many times demands that.

While I'm thinking of it, I agree with the RC Church's staunch pro-life stance, that it means more than just opposing abortion. That said, I'm not 100% against the death penalty.
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#9
(10-30-2020, 08:17 PM)Wingfold Wrote: While I'm thinking of it, I agree with the RC Church's staunch pro-life stance, that it means more than just opposing abortion. That said, I'm not 100% against the death penalty.

"Pro-life" means anti-abortion. One might include anti-euthanasia, but that's it. Anti-death-penalty, anti-war, and pro-welfare-state advocates try to borrow the term to promote their agenda, but there's a difference between opposing the killing of innocent life and punishing those who are guilty, particularly guilty of taking innocent life. The Church says capital punishment and war are sometimes moral. Abortion and euthanasia never are.
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#10
(10-30-2020, 08:17 PM)Wingfold Wrote: While I'm thinking of it, I agree with the RC Church's staunch pro-life stance, that it means more than just opposing abortion.

Don't confuse the stance post-Vatican II Jesuits as the Roman Catholic Church's stance.
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