Trump literally gives Netanyahu the key to the White House [video]
#1
Just a friendly reminder that our MAGA goggles blinded us to Trump's openly Zionist platform. America is nothing more than a territory in Greater Israel, and has been since 1948.

"The Heart of Jesus is closer to you when you suffer, than when you are full of joy." - St. Margaret Mary Alacoque

"In my bed by night I sought him whom my soul loveth: I sought him, and found him not. I will rise, and will go about the city: in the streets and the broad ways I will seek him whom my soul loveth: I sought him, and I found him not.The watchmen who keep the city, found me: Have you seen him, whom my soul loveth? When I had a little passed by them, I found him whom my soul loveth: I held him: and I will not let him go, till I bring him into my mother’s house, and into the chamber of her that bore me." - Cant. 3:1-4
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#2
To quote what Michael Matt so eloquently put, Catholic Traditionalists cannot fault Trump for not being morally perfect when the Church of Christ is not doing its job in adequately preaching the Gospel.


Trump might be a Zionist, but he's no neocon and I will take a Zionist anti-neocon any day over your run-of-the-mill neocon.
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#3
(09-15-2020, 09:55 PM)austenbosten Wrote: To quote what Michael Matt so eloquently put, Catholic Traditionalists cannot fault Trump for not being morally perfect when the Church of Christ is not doing its job in adequately preaching the Gospel.


Trump might be a Zionist, but he's no neocon and I will take a Zionist anti-neocon any day over your run-of-the-mill neocon.

I wasn't looking to disparage Trump's morals. But I am criticizing his Israel-first policies when he ran on a ticket of America-first back in 2016, and is doing the same thing right now.

The Neo-conservatism of the Reagan era all but died with the Bush era. Now it is either the party of Zionism (Republicans) or Socialism (Democrats).
"The Heart of Jesus is closer to you when you suffer, than when you are full of joy." - St. Margaret Mary Alacoque

"In my bed by night I sought him whom my soul loveth: I sought him, and found him not. I will rise, and will go about the city: in the streets and the broad ways I will seek him whom my soul loveth: I sought him, and I found him not.The watchmen who keep the city, found me: Have you seen him, whom my soul loveth? When I had a little passed by them, I found him whom my soul loveth: I held him: and I will not let him go, till I bring him into my mother’s house, and into the chamber of her that bore me." - Cant. 3:1-4
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#4
(09-15-2020, 10:48 PM)Augustinian Wrote:
(09-15-2020, 09:55 PM)austenbosten Wrote: To quote what Michael Matt so eloquently put, Catholic Traditionalists cannot fault Trump for not being morally perfect when the Church of Christ is not doing its job in adequately preaching the Gospel.


Trump might be a Zionist, but he's no neocon and I will take a Zionist anti-neocon any day over your run-of-the-mill neocon.

I wasn't looking to disparage Trump's morals. But I am criticizing his Israel-first policies when he ran on a ticket of America-first back in 2016, and is doing the same thing right now.

The Neo-conservatism of the Reagan era all but died with the Bush era. Now it is either the party of Zionism (Republicans) or Socialism (Democrats).

I recognize that President Trump has his flaws but can you provide some concrete examples of Trump placing Israeli interests before American interests?  Despite the flaws of the Israeli state, they've been better allies (note: not "friends") in a volatile region.  Geopolitics is a messy, complicated bit of business.  Even a strict policy of nonintervention and isolation wouldn't call for a lack of foreign allies.  I doubt we can shun the Israeli state and I'm not sure what our exact policy toward them should be.
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#5
(09-16-2020, 01:08 AM)SeekerofChrist Wrote: Despite the flaws of the Israeli state, they've been better allies (note: not "friends") in a volatile region.  Geopolitics is a messy, complicated bit of business.  Even a strict policy of nonintervention and isolation wouldn't call for a lack of foreign allies.  I doubt we can shun the Israeli state and I'm not sure what our exact policy toward them should be.

What benefits does this alliance have for the US, besides keeping the Jewish and Evangelical lobbies happy? It's of obvious benefit for Israel - they get someone to fight their wars for them. But how does being involved in the Middle East help the US?

(09-16-2020, 01:08 AM)Augustinian Wrote: Just a friendly reminder that our MAGA goggles blinded us to Trump's openly Zionist platform. America is nothing more than a territory in Greater Israel, and has been since 1948.

And that would have happened under Hillary, too. It's a fault of Trump, but no politician is perfect. I'd rather have Trump's Zionism over anything the Democrats want. At least he hasn't dragged the country into war with Syria or Iraq, and he's had plenty of opportunity to if he really wanted.
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#6
(09-16-2020, 01:08 AM)SeekerofChrist Wrote:
(09-15-2020, 10:48 PM)Augustinian Wrote:
(09-15-2020, 09:55 PM)austenbosten Wrote: To quote what Michael Matt so eloquently put, Catholic Traditionalists cannot fault Trump for not being morally perfect when the Church of Christ is not doing its job in adequately preaching the Gospel.


Trump might be a Zionist, but he's no neocon and I will take a Zionist anti-neocon any day over your run-of-the-mill neocon.

I wasn't looking to disparage Trump's morals. But I am criticizing his Israel-first policies when he ran on a ticket of America-first back in 2016, and is doing the same thing right now.

The Neo-conservatism of the Reagan era all but died with the Bush era. Now it is either the party of Zionism (Republicans) or Socialism (Democrats).

I recognize that President Trump has his flaws but can you provide some concrete examples of Trump placing Israeli interests before American interests?  Despite the flaws of the Israeli state, they've been better allies (note: not "friends") in a volatile region.  Geopolitics is a messy, complicated bit of business.  Even a strict policy of nonintervention and isolation wouldn't call for a lack of foreign allies.  I doubt we can shun the Israeli state and I'm not sure what our exact policy toward them should be.


Here's a few articles that link to sources of Trump's "Israel First" policies and actions:

https://www.veteranstoday.com/2019/07/20...gn-policy/
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/tru...and-israel
https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-...-semitism/
https://spectator.clingendael.org/en/pub...an-history
https://www.cufi.org/trump-spending-cuts...untouched/
https://fas.org/sgp/crs/mideast/RL33222.pdf
"The Heart of Jesus is closer to you when you suffer, than when you are full of joy." - St. Margaret Mary Alacoque

"In my bed by night I sought him whom my soul loveth: I sought him, and found him not. I will rise, and will go about the city: in the streets and the broad ways I will seek him whom my soul loveth: I sought him, and I found him not.The watchmen who keep the city, found me: Have you seen him, whom my soul loveth? When I had a little passed by them, I found him whom my soul loveth: I held him: and I will not let him go, till I bring him into my mother’s house, and into the chamber of her that bore me." - Cant. 3:1-4
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#7
(09-16-2020, 10:09 AM)Paul Wrote:
(09-16-2020, 01:08 AM)SeekerofChrist Wrote: Despite the flaws of the Israeli state, they've been better allies (note: not "friends") in a volatile region.  Geopolitics is a messy, complicated bit of business.  Even a strict policy of nonintervention and isolation wouldn't call for a lack of foreign allies.  I doubt we can shun the Israeli state and I'm not sure what our exact policy toward them should be.

What benefits does this alliance have for the US, besides keeping the Jewish and Evangelical lobbies happy? It's of obvious benefit for Israel - they get someone to fight their wars for them. But how does being involved in the Middle East help the US?

That's a fair question but to be honest, I don’t care one way or the other about the Israeli state or the Middle East so I am not going to waste my time or yours debating the merits or demerits of the Israeli-US alliance.  Since I don't really have any firm opinions about that subject, all I'm really interested in are concrete examples of President Trump engaging in Israel first, not America first, policies or actions.  I consider that an important issue and I am open to hearing about any evidence for it.
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#8
(09-16-2020, 10:24 AM)Augustinian Wrote:
(09-16-2020, 01:08 AM)SeekerofChrist Wrote:
(09-15-2020, 10:48 PM)Augustinian Wrote:
(09-15-2020, 09:55 PM)austenbosten Wrote: To quote what Michael Matt so eloquently put, Catholic Traditionalists cannot fault Trump for not being morally perfect when the Church of Christ is not doing its job in adequately preaching the Gospel.


Trump might be a Zionist, but he's no neocon and I will take a Zionist anti-neocon any day over your run-of-the-mill neocon.

I wasn't looking to disparage Trump's morals. But I am criticizing his Israel-first policies when he ran on a ticket of America-first back in 2016, and is doing the same thing right now.

The Neo-conservatism of the Reagan era all but died with the Bush era. Now it is either the party of Zionism (Republicans) or Socialism (Democrats).

I recognize that President Trump has his flaws but can you provide some concrete examples of Trump placing Israeli interests before American interests?  Despite the flaws of the Israeli state, they've been better allies (note: not "friends") in a volatile region.  Geopolitics is a messy, complicated bit of business.  Even a strict policy of nonintervention and isolation wouldn't call for a lack of foreign allies.  I doubt we can shun the Israeli state and I'm not sure what our exact policy toward them should be.


Here's a few articles that link to sources of Trump's "Israel First" policies and actions:

https://www.veteranstoday.com/2019/07/20...gn-policy/
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/tru...and-israel
https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-...-semitism/
https://spectator.clingendael.org/en/pub...an-history
https://www.cufi.org/trump-spending-cuts...untouched/
https://fas.org/sgp/crs/mideast/RL33222.pdf

Thank you, I will check these out. I have been concerned about the influence Trump’s Orthodox Jewish son-in-law might have on him.
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#9
(09-15-2020, 09:55 PM)austenbosten Wrote: Trump might be a Zionist, but he's no neocon and I will take a Zionist anti-neocon any day over your run-of-the-mill neocon.

I'll take neither, please.
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#10
(09-16-2020, 03:53 PM)Bonaventure Wrote:
(09-15-2020, 09:55 PM)austenbosten Wrote: Trump might be a Zionist, but he's no neocon and I will take a Zionist anti-neocon any day over your run-of-the-mill neocon.

I'll take neither, please.

Sorry, that's not an option.
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