Fetal Cell Lines in Vaccine Testing
#11
(12-14-2020, 12:32 PM)Steven Wrote: A good analysis from a local priest who specialises in ethics as pertains to life issues: https://www.hprweb.com/2020/12/should-ca...-vaccine/?  long story short is that it is licit to get the vaccine, but the AstraZeneca one should be avoided in favour of the Pfizer or Moderna ones.

Long story short is that he argues it is licit to get the vaccine. But liceity is only one part of the question. The prudence of taking it is also in dispute.
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Vos omnes amatores pulcherrimae linguae ecclesiae nostrae, videte filum quo de rebus sanctis profanisque colloqui possumus.
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#12
Nor am I an anti-vaxxer. I had friends die of tetanus and polio when I was younger. Other friends were crippled for life by polio. I thank God for the ingenuity of those who discovered vaccines for major diseases.

However, that said, I totally agree with you. I'd not done the research that you obviously have, but just based on my general knowledge of the science of vaccine development, there is no way on God's green earth that my wife or I are going to get any of these vaccines.

They have been rushed through development, without due diligence, in response to panic and heavy governmental pressure. Plus, of course, Big Pharma saw the dollar signs dancing in front of their eyes.

Both my wife and I keep having memories of another drug that wasn't properly tested. Anyone else remember 'flipper babies'? If not, search 'thalidomide'.
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#13
Concern about the vaccine is justified, to a point. Most will take it. Some won’t. Hopefully it doesn’t sterilize those who receive it or do anything else that’s evil like that. I know I sure don’t want anything Bill and Melinda Gates have put their money into. The others, however...if that’s what it takes to end the pandemic, then so be it. There are too many other problems that many in charge, particularly the Democrats, seem too thoughtless to consider. For all their talk about “the poor” and how the government must help them, they sure don’t seem to care that those same poor are the ones who lose their jobs because of these shutdowns, and they are the same poor who are forced out of public indoor places where they traditionally found shelter and into the elements and other dangers of being on the street. It would seem as much as certain liberals like to talk about how much concern they have for the poor, that they actually hate the poor.
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#14
(12-14-2020, 07:20 PM)Credidi Propter Wrote: Concern about the vaccine is justified, to a point. Most will take it. Some won’t. Hopefully it doesn’t sterilize those who receive it or do anything else that’s evil like that. I know I sure don’t want anything Bill and Melinda Gates have put their money into. The others, however...if that’s what it takes to end the pandemic, then so be it. There are too many other problems that many in charge, particularly the Democrats, seem too thoughtless to consider. For all their talk about “the poor” and how the government must help them, they sure don’t seem to care that those same poor are the ones who lose their jobs because of these shutdowns, and they are the same poor who are forced out of public indoor places where they traditionally found shelter and into the elements and other dangers of being on the street. It would seem as much as certain liberals like to talk about how much concern they have for the poor, that they actually hate the poor.

You're right about the Democrats. But I don't believe the vaccine is going to end the pandemic.

A single dose of the vaccine requires two separate injections, several weeks (I think it was two months?) apart.

After that, immunity probably won't last longer than a few months. The virus isn't going to disappear (although the hope is that it will mutate into a less dangerous form). In other words, you'll need to get another dose (2 injections) later on. And then again a few months later. And then again. And then again.

The media is already telling us that even with the vaccine, masks and social distancing will not end.


The key to get out of this tyranny is for people to start living their lives again despite government backlash, even knowing that most people have a 0.01% chance of dying if they catch the disease. (And no, I don't think enough people are going to start opening their businesses in NYC and LA and spitting on curfew mandates to make a difference; but that's just because I'm a pessimist/realist) Obviously people who are at higher risk need to take more precautions.

You're probably right that the vaccine is the only thing that will give most people the sense of security they need to go on with their lives. But it's an illusion of greater security, not a reality. I'm not willing to commit to getting 4 injections/year of a new, untested vaccine for the rest of my life, and I'm certainly not going to let my young children receive it.

So like I said before; the liceity of the vaccine is only one part of the question. The prudence of taking it is another. And I do see arguments on both sides, and I believe good people will fall on both sides of the argument. But I think the side I've chosen is true.
Filioli mei, non diligamus verbo neque lingua, sed opere et veritate.

Vos omnes amatores pulcherrimae linguae ecclesiae nostrae, videte filum quo de rebus sanctis profanisque colloqui possumus.
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#15
I've said this on other threads, and I'll say it again- I think vaccines made with fetal cell lines should not be looked at as individual instances, but as a precedent that needs to be stopped. Now.

Once we accept being compelled to take one particular vaccine with these cell lines, there will be nothing to stop them from compelling us to take them all. There will always be a public health emergency somewhere. Fetal cell lines are also not immortal. They will eventually have to make more, and they have, as recently as the past decade (Walvax-2, China). If we encourage them by our compliance to start making more vaccines this way, I would personally feel morally responsible for my part in that. 

The only way we can convince pharmaceutical companies that do not share our moral compass to stop producing vaccines this way (or at least provide alternatives)is for people to widely refuse to take them.
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#16
From Catholic Family News:

One Cardinal and Four Bishops Teach Clearly that Catholics Must Refuse Vaccines Tainted by Abortion
Jovan-Marya of the Immaculate Conception Weismiller, T.O.Carm.

Vive le Christ-roi! Vive le roi, Louis XX!
Deum timete, regem honorificate.
Kansan by birth! Albertan by choice! Jayhawk by the Grace of God!
“Qui me amat, amet et canem meum. (Who loves me will love my dog.)” 
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My Blog 'Musings of an Old Curmudgeon'
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#17
(12-15-2020, 05:42 PM)jovan66102 Wrote: From Catholic Family News:

One Cardinal and Four Bishops Teach Clearly that Catholics Must Refuse Vaccines Tainted by Abortion

Lately, the more I hear about Bp Strickland, the more I like him

Also, would people be so quick to say this was allowable if these were babies who were born instead of pre-born? I don’t understand the logic...
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