People have stopped believing in the supernatural
#1
In my opinion, the biggest challenge for the Catholic Church (in converting heathens and bringing back lapsed Catholics) is the total collapse of belief in the supernatural. I travel a lot (at least before Covid) and I live in Japan half of the year. In Thailand, Japan, Vietnam and other countries where Buddhism is a major religion, the temples are almost bankrupt. They have to sell land to developers to continue functioning. Most of the younger population don’t visit temples or make offerings anymore. It appears that when a society reaches a certain level of prosperity, people become dazzled by money, science, good medical care, and the Internet/social media, that they don’t see anymore the supernatural. 

I believe that only the grace of God will save the human race from materialism, which is the religion of the 20th and 21st centuries. It doesn’t matter if you tell people that materialism gave us the atomic bomb and the efficient mass murdering machines of Stalin, Mao and the Nazis. All they can see is Facebook, the Internet, the iPhone, shiny shopping malls, antibiotics and the birth control pill. 

I say this because, but for a miracle that happened to me in 2017, I came back to the Catholic Church after 40 years away. But this was only because of a rather spectacular miracle granted to me by Our Lord. I was, before that, a complete materialist, a feminist, a liberal. 

In my travels all over the world, I see nothing but the triumph of materialism.
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#2
(02-26-2021, 10:49 AM)Julia Augusta Wrote: In my travels all over the world, I see nothing but the triumph of materialism.

Majority-Mohammedan countries still believe in the supernatural, as do poorer countries.

Spiritual poverty, being close to the land, and the dignity of work are all values that we've lost as we've become richer and replaced real work with jobs that mostly don't need to exist.
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#3
(02-26-2021, 10:57 AM)ChairmanJoeAintMyPresident Wrote:
(02-26-2021, 10:49 AM)Julia Augusta Wrote: In my travels all over the world, I see nothing but the triumph of materialism.

Majority-Mohammedan countries still believe in the supernatural, as do poorer countries.

Spiritual poverty, being close to the land, and the dignity of work are all values that we've lost as we've become richer and replaced real work with jobs that mostly don't need to exist.
I’m in Dubai, which is a rather nice place to be during Covid. It’s very rich. No evidence of belief in the supernatural here.
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#4
(02-26-2021, 11:05 AM)Julia Augusta Wrote: I’m in Dubai, which is a rather nice place to be during Covid. It’s very rich. No evidence of belief in the supernatural here.

Their wealth makes them more like western Nones than like their poor neighbors, but I still think they have belief.

Mohammedanism is a confusing "religion" that praises many of the things we would condemn, so direct comparisons aren't obvious. What makes you say they don't believe in Dubai?
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#5
Quote:I say this because, but for a miracle that happened to me in 2017, I came back to the Catholic Church after 40 years away. But this was only because of a rather spectacular miracle granted to me by Our Lord. I was, before that, a complete materialist, a feminist, a liberal.

That sounds rather interesting. I would like to hear more. :)
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#6
In the West, there is a fascination with the New Age.   This is itself a reaction to the bankruptcy of materialism.
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#7
(02-26-2021, 11:53 AM)Matthew7-7 Wrote:
Quote:I say this because, but for a miracle that happened to me in 2017, I came back to the Catholic Church after 40 years away. But this was only because of a rather spectacular miracle granted to me by Our Lord. I was, before that, a complete materialist, a feminist, a liberal.

That sounds rather interesting. I would like to hear more. :)
Here is my blog post about the miracle that brought me back to the Church:
https://lapsedcatholicreturns.wordpress....ic-church/
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#8
(02-26-2021, 01:28 PM)Julia Augusta Wrote:
(02-26-2021, 11:53 AM)Matthew7-7 Wrote:
Quote:I say this because, but for a miracle that happened to me in 2017, I came back to the Catholic Church after 40 years away. But this was only because of a rather spectacular miracle granted to me by Our Lord. I was, before that, a complete materialist, a feminist, a liberal.

That sounds rather interesting. I would like to hear more. :)
Here is my blog post about the miracle that brought me back to the Church:
https://lapsedcatholicreturns.wordpress....ic-church/

WOW! Thank you for posting this! What a lovely reversion testimony!
"The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of the Conservatives is to prevent the mistakes from being corrected." - G. K. Chesterton
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#9
Well, you might be right.However , look at shows like Ghost Nation, Kindred Spirits, Ghost Adventures and others that have been on the Travel Channel and A&E Network etc.  The truth is  people want to believe there is an existance beyond this when we die, why else go around chasing spirits whether they are good or evil. People want to know there is more than this existance. In Mexico and points south, amongst at least the ordinary people, they believe in spirits and witches,etc. In Lousiana , Haiti etc.they still believe in Voodoo,etc. Same goes for Africa.It's just  in the West it  appears people don't care about the supernatural, but some of us do, or there wouldn't be all these ghost shows on tv.
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#10
(02-26-2021, 10:49 AM)Julia Augusta Wrote: In my opinion, the biggest challenge for the Catholic Church (in converting heathens and bringing back lapsed Catholics) is the total collapse of belief in the supernatural. I travel a lot (at least before Covid) and I live in Japan half of the year. In Thailand, Japan, Vietnam and other countries where Buddhism is a major religion, the temples are almost bankrupt. They have to sell land to developers to continue functioning. Most of the younger population don’t visit temples or make offerings anymore. It appears that when a society reaches a certain level of prosperity, people become dazzled by money, science, good medical care, and the Internet/social media, that they don’t see anymore the supernatural. 

I believe that only the grace of God will save the human race from materialism, which is the religion of the 20th and 21st centuries. It doesn’t matter if you tell people that materialism gave us the atomic bomb and the efficient mass murdering machines of Stalin, Mao and the Nazis. All they can see is Facebook, the Internet, the iPhone, shiny shopping malls, antibiotics and the birth control pill. 

I say this because, but for a miracle that happened to me in 2017, I came back to the Catholic Church after 40 years away. But this was only because of a rather spectacular miracle granted to me by Our Lord. I was, before that, a complete materialist, a feminist, a liberal. 

In my travels all over the world, I see nothing but the triumph of materialism.
I agree that materialism is the cause of the fallout, and I hope this will change, but I don't see it happening any time soon(short of a miracle).  

While better living conditions have an influence on people ignoring the supernatural,  it's not what makes materialism convincing.  The arguments for the materialist world view asserts less than the arguments normally used by essentialists.  That by itself is going to give the materialist the upper hand.

The atrocities of the 20th century doesn't disprove materialism by itself(morality when it is not simply a practical thing is ultimately an essentialist concept).  It might be fine for reinforcing our already held belief in the supernatural, but it's not a real argument against materialism.

This is not an easy beast to take down, and we should admit that.

I'm glad you came back to the faith.  Materialism is a difficult thing to escape.
My word choices are based on sound, not meaning.

Yes, that defeats the purpose of language.
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