Well, At Least Francis is Honest!
#1
He admits that he wants to build a 'church' different from the Catholic Church. Today may go down in history on a par with 31 October 1517!


From Fr Z's Blog


Francis Opens the Synod Quoting Congar: "We Must Not Make Another Church, We Must Make a Different Church"
Jovan-Marya of the Immaculate Conception Weismiller, T.O.Carm.

Vive le Christ-roi! Vive le roi, Louis XX!
Deum timete, regem honorificate.
Kansan by birth! Albertan by choice! Jayhawk by the Grace of God!
“Qui me amat, amet et canem meum. (Who loves me will love my dog.)” 
St Bernard of Clairvaux

My Blog 'Musings of an Old Curmudgeon'
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#2
Remind me again - what did Ven. Fulton Sheen say about the "ape of the Church"?
La fleur fade est de courtoisie,
La fleur de France s'est remise,
Le Roy Saint Louis, à l'ombre du chêne,
Brille pour cette terre promise.
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#3
(10-09-2021, 05:52 PM)jovan66102 Wrote: He admits that he wants to build a 'church' different from the Catholic Church. Today may go down in history on a par with 31 October 1517!


From Fr Z's Blog


Francis Opens the Synod Quoting Congar: "We Must Not Make Another Church, We Must Make a Different Church"
Not posting this in English on the Vatican website?? This smells like a barrel of rotten fish!
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#4
How much of all of this, is out of a need to save face? Are they trying to
double-down, in order to avoid facing the reality, that they failed?
Or does Pope Francis, in his heart of hearts, believe in these ideals?

“If we just push further, we will reach the goal set out by Saint John XXIII.”

It’s kind of ironic; this synod is all about the laity’s voices being heard, yet all the lay people on the traditional side seem to get from some of these prelates is heavy-handed, top-down chastisement.
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#5
(10-09-2021, 07:28 PM)TheGhostlyOne Wrote: How much of all of this, is out of a need to save face? Are they trying to
double-down, in order to avoid facing the reality, that they failed?
Or does Pope Francis, in his heart of hearts, believe in these ideals?

“If we just push further, we will reach the goal set out by Saint John XXIII.”

It’s kind of ironic; this synod is all about the laity’s voices being heard, yet all the lay people on the traditional side seem to get from some of these prelates is heavy-handed, top-down chastisement.
Some are more equal than others.
“But all will be well, and all will be well, and every kind of thing will be well.” ~Julian of Norwich

"Sometimes you're the windshield.  Sometimes you're the bug."~Mark Knopfler (?)

"No matter who you are somebody thinks you're a heretic. Wear it like a badge of honor........... :LOL:"~Silouan

The fact that I "like" a post is not necessarily an endorsement or approval of its content.
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#6
(10-09-2021, 07:28 PM)TheGhostlyOne Wrote: How much of all of this, is out of a need to save face? Are they trying to
double-down, in order to avoid facing the reality, that they failed?
Or does Pope Francis, in his heart of hearts, believe in these ideals?

I think it's a combination of both. On the one hand, they've invested their entire lives in the 'Spirit of Vatican II' and they are finally coming to the realisation that the Council, as implemented, was a massive failure.

On the other hand, I think that Francis and many of his Episcopal lickspittle toadies do actually believe that Holy Scripture, Our Lord, the Fathers and Doctors of the Church, and the Immemorial and Infallible Magisterium are simply wrong and that they know better. They are trying to destroy the Church in order to rebuild it in their own images, the Body of Man rather than the Mystical Body of Christ.
Jovan-Marya of the Immaculate Conception Weismiller, T.O.Carm.

Vive le Christ-roi! Vive le roi, Louis XX!
Deum timete, regem honorificate.
Kansan by birth! Albertan by choice! Jayhawk by the Grace of God!
“Qui me amat, amet et canem meum. (Who loves me will love my dog.)” 
St Bernard of Clairvaux

My Blog 'Musings of an Old Curmudgeon'
FishEaters Group on MeWe
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#7
(10-09-2021, 10:50 PM)jovan66102 Wrote:
(10-09-2021, 07:28 PM)TheGhostlyOne Wrote: How much of all of this, is out of a need to save face? Are they trying to
double-down, in order to avoid facing the reality, that they failed?
Or does Pope Francis, in his heart of hearts, believe in these ideals?

I think it's a combination of both. On the one hand, they've invested their entire lives in the 'Spirit of Vatican II' and they are finally coming to the realisation that the Council, as implemented, was a massive failure.

On the other hand, I think that Francis and many of his Episcopal lickspittle toadies do actually believe that Holy Scripture, Our Lord, the Fathers and Doctors of the Church, and the Immemorial and Infallible Magisterium are simply wrong and that they know better. They are trying to destroy the Church in order to rebuild it in their own images, the Body of Man rather than the Mystical Body of Christ.

Great way to put it. It would be nice if they could understand that the “Body of Man” is of zero use to people. There’s absolutely no reason to get up in the morning, get kids ready, and drive to church, for the “Body of Man.” If the Faith was like it is described by Francis, there’s no reason not to sleep in, and enjoy yourself. 

75 years ago, the seminaries had to have been heterodox to the extreme. As you have said, it is like their entire concept of what a church is, is different. It’s one not worth fooling with.
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#8
(10-09-2021, 06:26 PM)HomerD Wrote:
(10-09-2021, 05:52 PM)jovan66102 Wrote: He admits that he wants to build a 'church' different from the Catholic Church. Today may go down in history on a par with 31 October 1517!


From Fr Z's Blog


Francis Opens the Synod Quoting Congar: "We Must Not Make Another Church, We Must Make a Different Church"
Not posting this in English on the Vatican website?? This smells like a barrel of rotten fish!

It would be a great deal better if they posted all the documents only in Latin, then let the Bishops translate for their diocese. That would be really impartial and we could benefit from the really funny translations of some of the Bishops, especially the most novus-ordish ones.
Ores, casta legas, jejunes otia vites si servare velis corpora casta Deo.
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#9
at the risk of sounding uninformed, isnt relying on early church fathers the fallacy known was "appeal to antiquity"? If they were right,they were right because they were right. But not because they are just ancient?
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#10
(10-13-2021, 06:47 PM)xsantiagox Wrote: at the risk of sounding uninformed, isnt relying on early church fathers the fallacy known was "appeal to antiquity"? If they were right,they were right because they were right. But not because they are just ancient?
I'm not sure what prompted your question, but no one is making an appeal to antiquity. The Church Fathers are right because they wrote within the sensus Fidelium and have been proven right by the immemorial and infallible Magisterium.
Jovan-Marya of the Immaculate Conception Weismiller, T.O.Carm.

Vive le Christ-roi! Vive le roi, Louis XX!
Deum timete, regem honorificate.
Kansan by birth! Albertan by choice! Jayhawk by the Grace of God!
“Qui me amat, amet et canem meum. (Who loves me will love my dog.)” 
St Bernard of Clairvaux

My Blog 'Musings of an Old Curmudgeon'
FishEaters Group on MeWe
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